Sportsman Class at Nationals

[4xFord]

I have done everything you have mentioned Mark. No matter what you are limited to the MRC axles and trans. Your "TEAM LOSI ROCKS" comment kind of tells me how you feel about them.

To be honest, I like 1.9. I took 3rd in Texas State Finals in 1.9. I have been tuning my mini juice more and more lately and it is VERY impressive. However if I had a choice I would ditch 1.9 for a 2.2 sportsman any day. Just my opinion.

[hbj069]

A lot of hate and discontent and for what??

If you don't want to run or build a sportsman rig then ok no problem, that's what makes us individuals and why we currently have 3 classes and its called choice.

We are going to run and have fun.

If you want to see what all the fuss is about then come on out to the Turkey Crawl where we have 46 2.2 drivers and 18 sportsman drivers and then you yourself can do a poll to see what actual costs are, with out all the BS.

[ROCKEDUP RICKY]

Our sportsman class, we let you run what ever you got. shafty, moa, dig, no dig. We give them more points and time to do the same courses as the pro class. We all run together and they get to move up when ever they want to.

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by 4xFord

Same reason as all of the other classes. Fun to drive and compete in. I would love to see sportsman come into its own.

Hell yes. Because they would be two completely different classes with different courses.

Great answer... because you gave an actual answer, and didn't try to perpetuate the economic myth.

Originally Posted by HBJ069

We are going to run and have fun

BTW.....I never said it wouldn't be a fun or competitive class. I just said it wouldn't be a cheap or economical class at the National Level.

[greencrawler]

Let me ask this, why couldn't they make 2.2 and 1.9 optional classes for the nationals? Meaning you have the choice to run either/or when totalling up for over all scoring. I would like to run some national level events this coming year but don't have a 1.9 to compete with and have no interest in getting one, I have a sportsman and 2.2pro and that's all that I want

[SoCo Crawlgirl]

Originally Posted by Fishmaxx

Great answer... because you gave an actual answer, and didn't try to perpetuate the economic myth.



BTW.....I never said it wouldn't be a fun or competitive class. I just said it wouldn't be a cheap or economical class at the National Level.

for once i agree with fish, yes it's a fun class. other than that, and i love sport drivers and wish i could go back to simplicity of a sport rig, i think it is funny how people can say it's cheaper to run sport, once again boys are constantly changing and tweaking on their rigs to get more performance out of it, pro or sport or novice, guys will dump a ton of money or fab up their own stuff to get their rig to work better. and the amount of money you spend on a rig will not get you into nationals it's your driving. and i hear alot of people they want to stay sport because they can't handle the pressure of a dig or pro class, then how can you handle the pressure of nationals. i would love to see sport at nats, i love to cheer the guys n girls on, but with a big event you have to look at demand. they might travel across/with in their state but would they travel from japan or across country for a sport class? i think they should start at the state/ regional level and when you start having a huge turn outs like you do for pro they might then take it in to consideration.

GO SPORT DRIVERS!

[Eritex Inc.]

Originally Posted by hbj069

A lot of hate and discontent and for what??

If you don't want to run or build a sportsman rig then ok no problem, that's what makes us individuals and why we currently have 3 classes and its called choice.

We are going to run and have fun.

If you want to see what all the fuss is about then come on out to the Turkey Crawl where we have 46 2.2 drivers and 18 sportsman drivers and then you yourself can do a poll to see what actual costs are, with out all the BS.

I am not sure if the hate and discontent remarks were aimed at myself but let me reassure you that I have no hard feeling about anything said in this thread nor have I become upset. What I was trying to prove is the the premise that the Sportsman class is a less expensive way to crawl is a myth.

Also, with what you posted about the numbers being BS, the trucks I described in my comparison are dead ringers for what my son and I run so I know the numbers are solid

[SoCo Crawlgirl]

Originally Posted by greencrawler

Let me ask this, why couldn't they make 2.2 and 1.9 optional classes for the nationals? Meaning you have the choice to run either/or when totalling up for over all scoring. I would like to run some national level events this coming year but don't have a 1.9 to compete with and have no interest in getting one, I have a sportsman and 2.2pro and that's all that I want

so if you have a 2.2 pro rig run it at a national event. you don't need a 1.9 to run at a national event or a super. by adding a sport class wether optional or not, you are still adding an extra class which means more time and judges and extra set up and tear down time. those guys are up at 4 am on the rocks by 5am to set up all the courses and equipment and there past dark tearing down, picking up trash, fighting bugs and driving back to the hotel and up again the next day to set up again. I was there from 5am to tear down all 4 days and it is a tough event to run, those poor guys are beat! by the end of the 2nd day. it takes alot to run a big event. and all the volunteers do it for free and the love of the sport. I'm sure if the #'s supported it they would do it and if more people would step up to help, but lets face it, it takes a lot of balls to judge at a national level, it's hard to find fair/knowledgable judges that can stand up to alot of emotional drivers mad that they got called on a gate when they spent so much time and money to get there. i helped judge at a regional event and after the temper tantrums and bullying of judges i saw by grown men, i will only judge at a local level.

[hbj069]

Originally Posted by Fishmaxx

Great answer... because you gave an actual answer, and didn't try to perpetuate the economic myth.



BTW.....I never said it wouldn't be a fun or competitive class. I just said it wouldn't be a cheap or economical class at the National Level.

Myth?? Where is yours?? Mine is sitting here and I am positive I have way less in it than I have in any of my past 3 bergs or either one of my XR10's. Fact not MYTH

Originally Posted by Eritex Inc.

I am not sure if the hate and discontent remarks were aimed at myself but let me reassure you that I have no hard feeling about anything said in this thread nor have I become upset. What I was trying to prove is the the premise that the Sportsman class is a less expensive way to crawl is a myth.

Also, with what you posted about the numbers being BS, the trucks I described in my comparison are dead ringers for what my son and I run so I know the numbers are solid

No No not at you, I promise, no hard feelings but as stated above that one will be hard to prove to me since I just built both AND Not trying to incite a riot here but it basically boils down to preference. I have built several trucks in the past 22 years. I know for a fact what it takes to build a competitive sportsman class truck. . I just completed mine and there is a huge difference between it and my last 3 bergs as well as my current XR10's.
I looked at the for sale section last night and there was a NEW set of axial axles for 50 bucks with the straight axle conversion. I sure haven't seen any berg or Xr10 axles that cheap Also there was a GC3A chassis NIB on the forum a few nights before, HMMM I got that one for $50.00 shipped, Now I dont care how you add it up thats almost a roller for $100.

[Eritex Inc.]

Originally Posted by hbj069

Myth?? Where is yours?? Mine is sitting here and I am positive I have way less in it than I have in any of my past 3 bergs or either one of my XR10's. Fact not MYTH



No No not at you, I promise, no hard feelings but as stated above that one will be hard to prove to me since I just built both AND Not trying to incite a riot here but it basically boils down to preference. I have built several trucks in the past 22 years. I know for a fact what it takes to build a competitive sportsman class truck. . I just completed mine and there is a huge difference between it and my last 3 bergs as well as my current XR10's.
I looked at the for sale section last night and there was a NEW set of axial axles for 50 bucks with the straight axle conversion. I sure haven't seen any berg or Xr10 axles that cheap Also there was a GC3A chassis NIB on the forum a few nights before, HMMM I got that one for $50.00 shipped, Now I dont care how you add it up thats almost a roller for $100.

I know this is WAY sidetracked, but a chassis and axles for $100.00 does not come close to a roller. Add cheap shocks, trans, and drive shafts and you are in the $160.00 to $180.00 range with all used parts with no wheels, tires, or electronics.

Or spend $299.99...

http://store.rc4wd.com/Mk42-MOA-Craw...dio-_p_14.html

and then another $32.99 for the charger...

http://www.valuehobby.com/product_de...13&item_id=109

and 3 of these with a total $24.60...

http://www.valuehobby.com/product_de...=7&item_id=185

...and you walk away spending $357.58 plus shipping and you have a complete crawler you can start playing with and upgrading. Even if you go for a new radio and dig setup you are looking at adding $150.00.


Like I keep saying, you cannot win a "Sportsman is a cheaper way to get into crawling" debate. The numbers I gave are for NEW products...not used.

[Fishmaxx]

Originally Posted by hbj069

Myth?? Where is yours?? Mine is sitting here and I am positive I have way less in it than I have in any of my past 3 bergs or either one of my XR10's. Fact not MYTH

There is a huge difference between used stuff, the stuff laying around garage, and a Nationals Level truck. You should compare New to New or Used to Used.

If you talk about creating a class it should talking about the long haul...not with what laying around and cheap in the For Sale section this week. Besides if sportsman took off like you say then the cheap used market would dry up.

New AX10 kits still go $250....about same as XR10's and Berg Axles.

I am not against having a 2.2 Pro Shaft Class, but if your thinking the Top 20 drivers are going to show up at Nationals with a $300 used rigs ......I will take that bet.

[hbj069]

Ok you guys win, Its not worth the time and effort to prove what I have already done, And for the record Austins truck was 2 years old that won the nats Not bad for some old stuff laying around the garage.

[mark reel]

Originally Posted by 4xFord

I have done everything you have mentioned Mark. No matter what you are limited to the MRC axles and trans. Your "TEAM LOSI ROCKS" comment kind of tells me how you feel about them.

To be honest, I like 1.9. I took 3rd in Texas State Finals in 1.9. I have been tuning my mini juice more and more lately and it is VERY impressive. However if I had a choice I would ditch 1.9 for a 2.2 sportsman any day. Just my opinion.

just so there is no missunderstanding i wasnt attacking, just trying to help if there were things you had not tried on the 1.9.
and you are for certon intitled to your opinion, (respectfully)
see ya out on the rocks

[Del Montess]

If you're going that route, why not add a 2.2 "unlimited" class. it would be the same arguments back and forth (except the economical argument... I don't think anyone would try to say an unlimited class would be cheaper ). It's all been said before.

Taking out 1.9s is kind of silly. I've seen spectacular turnout at a bunch of comps in a bunch of areas for the 1.9s, and very little turnout in a bunch of areas for sportsman class. It's got a lot more involvement and will continue to grow.

as far as calling 1.9s the "Losi" class... I would wager just about anything that other companies are coming up with 1.9 platforms. It's still a relatively new class, which should make it pretty obvious as to why Losi has the monopoly on the market for now. With it's obvious growth as a competitive class other companies will probably be jumping on the chance to increase their product base to be competitive with Losi.

sure, competing without dig is a nice challenge and change from the regular class, but if you ask any of the top-level drivers, would they be willing to give up their rig with dig for it? I doubt it. also, those same top-level drivers started without dig--hence why some asked about bringing it back as a "nostalgia" class, and that idea died down pretty quick.

and lastly-- it definitely shouldn't be called a "shafty" class. I'm pretty sure a shafty just kicked ass and took the utah state championship on saturday, beating out quite a few MOAs to do so. so, at least for now, shaftys belong in the nationals alongside the MOAs, not separate.

[Pdog7]

Originally Posted by Del Montess

If you're going that route, why not add a 2.2 "unlimited" class. it would be the same arguments back and forth (except the economical argument... I don't think anyone would try to say an unlimited class would be cheaper ). It's all been said before.

Taking out 1.9s is kind of silly. I've seen spectacular turnout at a bunch of comps in a bunch of areas for the 1.9s, and very little turnout in a bunch of areas for sportsman class. It's got a lot more involvement and will continue to grow.

as far as calling 1.9s the "Losi" class... I would wager just about anything that other companies are coming up with 1.9 platforms. It's still a relatively new class, which should make it pretty obvious as to why Losi has the monopoly on the market for now. With it's obvious growth as a competitive class other companies will probably be jumping on the chance to increase their product base to be competitive with Losi.

sure, competing without dig is a nice challenge and change from the regular class, but if you ask any of the top-level drivers, would they be willing to give up their rig with dig for it? I doubt it. also, those same top-level drivers started without dig--hence why some asked about bringing it back as a "nostalgia" class, and that idea died down pretty quick.

and lastly-- it definitely shouldn't be called a "shafty" class. I'm pretty sure a shafty just kicked ass and took the utah state championship on saturday, beating out quite a few MOAs to do so. so, at least for now, shaftys belong in the nationals alongside the MOAs, not separate.

I just checked the results and that was a definitive win. Way to go Jake

[binaryterror]

Originally Posted by Del Montess

as far as calling 1.9s the "Losi" class... I would wager just about anything that other companies are coming up with 1.9 platforms. It's still a relatively new class, which should make it pretty obvious as to why Losi has the monopoly on the market for now. With it's obvious growth as a competitive class other companies will probably be jumping on the chance to increase their product base to be competitive with Losi.

Problem is this was the case when the class was created way too long ago. Losi is the ONLY company with one and the only one in the works with one. We were told by people that others had them coming in 2008...this never happened.

It is a Losi class and will probably die that way since for 2 years not a single mention of another 1.9 is out or expected again this year at RCX.

[dpdsurf]

Originally Posted by binaryterror

Problem is this was the case when the class was created way too long ago. Losi is the ONLY company with one and the only one in the works with one. We were told by people that others had them coming in 2008...this never happened.

It is a Losi class and will probably die that way since for 2 years not a single mention of another 1.9 is out or expected again this year at RCX.

I feel that interest in 1.9 faded in our area because of this. Of the 4 sanctioned plus 3-4 additional clubs in Norcal none of them are offering the class this season.

It seams there are 2 agendas behind the "Sportsman" class. The first being an entry level "novice" class where they might run on the same courses or first few gates as the 2.2 pro class. The second being a class that is handled completely separate like 1.9 and super so that 2.2 pros can chose to drive in it. If this class were held at Nationals I believe it should be the latter.

The best way to get this into Nats would be commitment by drivers. Maybe the USRCCA could offer tickets for the class with the stipulation that a certain number of spots need to be sold and if not your fee will be refunded.

[BILLYGOAT]

just a thought, i believe the sportsman class should be open to all. i understand the idea of a "bridge" class to trasition a new driver ,to the pro class. a non dig 2ch class driven by novice and pro drivers will give the novice more knowledge by watching and listening to the pro drivers . putting the two together would help the novice driver and give the pro driver a chance to show the novice a new angle on gate progression, time managment , point managnent(when to take that reverse?)and rig set up. though i have driven in many pro events, i think this could be a bright fresh class where pros could give a little back and help advance this sport i love. whereby, the main objective is FUN. i think given a little time and effort , it could be a fun class for all drivers.

[ROCKEDUP RICKY]

I still think we have a no dig class already, the 1.9 class.

[greencrawler]

This is a never ending debate that is all based on preference. I personally prefer sportsman over 1.9 but others do not. So where does the line need to be drawn as to which class has the right to nationals comps? Sportsman can be a novice and a pro class the seperation is in course design.