A thread about Weight

[rob_b]

Originally Posted by Erik D_lux

$10 shipped? Serious?

$10 links, I thought the price was kinda steep! LOL a 3' stick of 3/16" 6061 is like $0.88.

Originally Posted by Erik D_lux

Can you put the electronics on your links? That would be super sick to have close to zero weight on the chassis.

My experience with a Berg was that it was possible to have too little sprung weight. All of the electronics minus the steering servo were chassis mounted. And remember half the weight of anything on the links is still sprung weight.

Originally Posted by Erik D_lux

Moving all my weight forward made my car a climbing machine!

Hows it go down hill? Lite is good but balance is better. Most of the courses our club builds have technical downhills too.


When I first built my CCR I cut out full length plates front and rear to get the weight ON THE AXLE. Here is a picture of the servo/battery plate.

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by djjiz

Yea.. I'm a little slow I see the bug now

The mounts look pretty sweet. You ever weigh those?

I run a screw into each cross brace and so far so good.

I will weigh them later for you. They are surprisingly light. Another reason I like them is because they hold the body really tight and dont let it move. When I ran the typical pins up top my body flopped around.

Speaking of bodies...

CKRC "heavy duty" bug body 4.5oz (if I remember right)

Proline bug body 2.4oz

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by rob_b

$10 links, I thought the price was kinda steep! LOL a 3' stick of 3/16" 6061 is like $0.88.



My experience with a Berg was that it was possible to have too little sprung weight. All of the electronics minus the steering servo were chassis mounted. And remember half the weight of anything on the links is still sprung weight.



Hows it go down hill? Lite is good but balance is better. Most of the courses our club builds have technical downhills too.


When I first built my CCR I cut out full length plates front and rear to get the weight ON THE AXLE. Here is a picture of the servo/battery plate.

Let me know when youre ready to make me some more for $10.

It goes downhill about the same as before, not great. I feel like I can compensate better with my driving going downhill. I feel like there is less that I can do with driving trying to go up hill so I offset the balance to make a better climber.

I have thought about battery trays like that before that mount under the servo/with the servo. I dont think the weight is any different than being on the links. The links are mounted under the servo too... Another way I think about it is if you were to take that mount and stretch it 3 feet behind the car would the weight still be "on the axle"? If you stretched it 3 feet in front of the car would it still be "on the axle"? I think the weight distributes where it is physically, not where it attaches to. My guess would be that if you found the balance of the car with it on the links it would have the same exact balance point with it mounted under the servo.

[rob_b]

You are correct the COG would not change by being link or plate mounted. But the sprung/unsprung ratio defiantly changes which changes how much weight is transfered in different situations.

[wrightcs77]

[QUOTE=Erik D_lux;2584095]I was putting off the different screws because I only thought of the TI upgrade. Thats just too much money for me for a little gain. I didnt think about aluminum.

Like you started out, maybe it would be cool to list where AL works and where TI works. I am going to take a look at it.
QUOTE]

Aluminum screws work well for all screws in/on the transmission. They work great for the mounts/pivots for the upper shock arms. Also work well in the upper link screws.

Here is the link to the aluminum screws.

http://www.fastener-express.com/

Here is a link on how to measure screw length, for those that don't know.
http://www.boltdepot.com/fastener-in...re-Length.aspx

[Sneed]

rob b, I'm liking the servo/battery mount. So much so, that I built my own. I still use the stock servo/axle mount, then made my lexan plate so that it would fasten to it. My intentions were to eliminate some sprung weight. My only issue's are that I couldn't make it too long. At full droop, the driveshaft hits the plate. It flexes fine, just don't like it to hit. Also while the front axle articulates, the battery hits the shocks. Which these things may not be that big of a concern. Will know more this weekend.

As far as eliminating all the weight you can, I still think theres a balance needed. I've dropped some, but not all. I went as far as, graphite shock towers, mini nuts, micro dig servo and Ti links. I don't know if the extra $$$$ in all aluminum trans parts or hardware is worth the penny. Maybe I'll try. I honestly don't know if I could even tell the difference in all those changes

[scatterbrains]

As far as eliminating all the weight you can, I still think theres a balance needed. I've dropped some, but not all. I went as far as, graphite shock towers, mini nuts, micro dig servo and Ti links. I don't know if the extra $$$$ in all aluminum trans parts or hardware is worth the penny. Maybe I'll try. I honestly don't know if I could even tell the difference in all those changes

Very well worth the money you lose almost 2oz (if i recall correctly) In ROTATING weight. What that means is it spools up faster has better wheel speed and is way more responsive. I count the trans upgrades as the BEST thing i have done to my LCC. Worth every penny

[djjiz]

Originally Posted by scatterbrains

Very well worth the money you lose almost 2oz (if i recall correctly) In ROTATING weight. What that means is it spools up faster has better wheel speed and is way more responsive. I count the trans upgrades as the BEST thing i have done to my LCC. Worth every penny

I second the above statement. Once you hold just the idler and main shaft alone you will understand how important that mod is

[fishnride883]

As a noob, I find this thread EXTREMELY helpful!!!! now its off to do some tweaking...Thanks..LOL!

[KBrog]

Ive been messing around with weight of my Losi also. When the rear wheels got to light one of the rear tires would lift off the ground and it would roll over to easy. It was to light to make the chassis articulate. I like just enuff weight in each rear wheel to make the suspension move to full swing without a tire lifting before hitting the limiters. Im still working on what amount of weight that is. I also did all the AL trans upgrades including AL screws and nuts through out the rig.

[scatterbrains]

Originally Posted by KBrog

Ive been messing around with weight of my Losi also. When the rear wheels got to light one of the rear tires would lift off the ground and it would roll over to easy. It was to light to make the chassis articulate. I like just enuff weight in each rear wheel to make the suspension move to full swing without a tire lifting before hitting the limiters. Im still working on what amount of weight that is. I also did all the AL trans upgrades including AL screws and nuts through out the rig.

have you tried going to a lighter oil, or larger holed piston? would help in that sort of situation

[rob_b]

Originally Posted by Sneed

My only issue's are that I couldn't make it too long. At full droop, the driveshaft hits the plate. Also while the front axle articulates, the battery hits the shocks. Which these things may not be that big of a concern.

You can't tell from the angle in the picture but right behind the servo the plate is bent up around 9deg to clear the shaft. With the front shocks flipped and out-boarded the battery just touches the spring during articulation.

[shelljeep]

I agree with moving weight forward.
I'd like to see someone make an offset servo plate that would allow you to mount the battery next to the servo. Right now, mine is on the front links.

I have played around alot with weight placement. Not so much with weight reduction via materials though. That's my next phase I guess. I know I like delrin. I run 3/8" lowers, 5/16" uppers.

I like the stock LCC wheels. They have survived every lawndart landing I have made so far and I have spent entire packs trying to make 3' high steep climbs that might only make once in 20 tries.

I have rebuilt my links many times, chopping the fronts and building longer rears to shove my bias forward. You can go too far with this.
When my front links were 3.5" long eye to eye(rears were 6", hence the 3/8" delrin), they didn't have enough leverage to work the suspension. The 65/35 weight distribution was great for long steep climbs, but the lack of uptravel in the front wasn't worth it. I tried 15 wt oil up there, along with large hole pistons and high anti-dive, still couldn't get the 3.5" links to work right. 3.5" is just too short.

Swapped to Jato's up front and now, at 4.25" long, they work well. I need to do my corner weights again to see what my bias is. Still climbs like a goat.

When I got my weight bias settled in around the 60/40 range w/o tires, I took the weight out of the fronts. No bueno. Easy way to drop a pound, but you need the unsprung weight there. 60/40 bias with your chassis and axles is no substitute.

Great thread Erik!

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by KBrog

Ive been messing around with weight of my Losi also. When the rear wheels got to light one of the rear tires would lift off the ground and it would roll over to easy. It was to light to make the chassis articulate. I like just enuff weight in each rear wheel to make the suspension move to full swing without a tire lifting before hitting the limiters. Im still working on what amount of weight that is. I also did all the AL trans upgrades including AL screws and nuts through out the rig.

Not to pimp my own stuff but,... some shock rod ends that I sell would really help in that situation. Those stock plastic rod ends really limit the suspension and cause a lot of drag. I am not sure how much less weight you could run in the rear than I do and I get full articulation, no problem. Thats with orange pistions and 50wt oil in the back.

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by rob_b

My experience with a Berg was that it was possible to have too little sprung weight.

Can you explain the drawbacks?

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by djjiz

The mounts look pretty sweet. You ever weigh those?

Gunners mounts can vary quite a bit depending on application.

On my application it looks like 5g



If you run two through the two top cross posts you are 6g



If you run a stock setup with two on each side you are looking at approx 12g

[Erik D_lux]

Originally Posted by shelljeep

I have rebuilt my links many times, chopping the fronts and building longer rears to shove my bias forward. You can go too far with this.
When my front links were 3.5" long eye to eye(rears were 6", hence the 3/8" delrin), they didn't have enough leverage to work the suspension. The 65/35 weight distribution was great for long steep climbs, but the lack of uptravel in the front wasn't worth it. I tried 15 wt oil up there, along with large hole pistons and high anti-dive, still couldn't get the 3.5" links to work right. 3.5" is just too short.

Swapped to Jato's up front and now, at 4.25" long, they work well. I need to do my corner weights again to see what my bias is. Still climbs like a goat.

Very interesting. I never thought about changing link lengths more than just adding .25 to my rears.

What lengths did you settle on? 4.25" overall length in the front?

[Erik D_lux]

There are obviously a lot of things to consider however, after moving everything to the front every line that I do is MUCH easier. I have done these lines 100's of times and know them well and how my car reacts.

Here is a vid I took today. Before moving my weight I could do it successfully maybe 2 out of 10 times. Today it didnt matter. I could really botch up the line (as seen in the one vid) and not come close to rolling. Today I was making it 10 out of 10 times.

Same obstacle, different views.

[shelljeep]

Yes, 4.25. Rears are 5.75. These re the lower's specs. And these are on Worminator axles. Yours will be different of course. Basically, I have settled into a setup where my fronts are 74% of the rears' length.

[shelljeep]

Erik wheels in a flower garden. Pansy.