Gun and knife picture thread!

[hpiguy]

Spent most of the day at the range today. The Tikka was flawless, as expected. The M5 was tight at first, had some failure to feed early on. But after 20 or so rounds, a couple cleanings (I have my own method for new guns, YMMV) and some extra lube, she ran great. The Tikka will of course be the precision gun of the two, but damn that M5 is really fun to shoot! I can see how it could get expensive in a hurry banging steel not going for groups. Both brakes worked very well, the M5 is probably the softer to shoot of the two. Makes sense, it's a good 3lbs heavier and a gas gun to boot. My buddy claims the VG6 brake is roughly eleventy thousand percent worse to sit next to for spotting, the Strike Industries brake doesn't phase him. We were nice today and warned everybody, these will be LOUD!



Marked all my brass, and sorted by weapon it was fired from for fire formed brass.

[slowmethinks]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

I agree, but gun snobs turn their nose up at Rock Island. I don't know why because everybody that I know that has one has had great experiences with them.

I had an Officers Carry from RI. It was a turd from day one. It often jammed up with failure to fully chber a round. I tried different mags and it didn't fix the issue. Grease helped a little, but it didn't go away. Light polishing on the rails didn't help either. I dumped it.

Want a good 1911 for the money, Sig is where it's at. They have two variations, the classic 1911 slide and a slide with their signature horizontal shelf.

You can get a lot of nice goodies and sleek lines and finishes for under $1K.

[hpiguy]

So, a few more thoughts from yesterday. I fired 53 rounds in roughly five hours, 26 from the Tikka, and 27 from the M5. That's slow controlled shooting from both. Very doable and affordable once or twice a month.

We measured the trigger on the Tikka (forgot to check the M5, DOH!) at 1 pound 6 ounces. Going back and forth between the two the Tikka trigger would catch me by surprise every single time, which is what you want. The M5 was more of a deliberate slow pull, but that's not to say the Rise Armament trigger is bad, it just has a couple extra pounds of pull weight is all. For shooting bug holes in paper, I'd like a lighter trigger personally. But for a dual use (target/hunting) rifle, it will be fine I'm sure.

One interesting thing to note, I shot Privi Partizan 168gr BTHP pretty much all day. Towards the end, I hand fed some Federal 168gr BTHP Gold Medal Match in the Tikka, and those weren't even on paper at 100yds. Just goes to show that even when shooting ammo of the same weight, they can be REALLY far off your sight in. So if you sight in with one round, and plan to hunt or shoot a match with something else, check that zero with the new ammo first!!

[stevejr]

Originally Posted by hpiguy

So, a few more thoughts from yesterday. I fired 53 rounds in roughly five hours, 26 from the Tikka, and 27 from the M5. That's slow controlled shooting from both. Very doable and affordable once or twice a month.

We measured the trigger on the Tikka (forgot to check the M5, DOH!) at 1 pound 6 ounces. Going back and forth between the two the Tikka trigger would catch me by surprise every single time, which is what you want. The M5 was more of a deliberate slow pull, but that's not to say the Rise Armament trigger is bad, it just has a couple extra pounds of pull weight is all. For shooting bug holes in paper, I'd like a lighter trigger personally. But for a dual use (target/hunting) rifle, it will be fine I'm sure.

One interesting thing to note, I shot Privi Partizan 168gr BTHP pretty much all day. Towards the end, I hand fed some Federal 168gr BTHP Gold Medal Match in the Tikka, and those weren't even on paper at 100yds. Just goes to show that even when shooting ammo of the same weight, they can be REALLY far off your sight in. So if you sight in with one round, and plan to hunt or shoot a match with something else, check that zero with the new ammo first!!

Do they have the Ballistic information listed on your boxes? How was your point of impact different from your point of aim with the Federal ammo? I know you weren't on paper but how big were your targets? I'm curious to know if it's just a velocity issue or if the BC of the bullets are wildly different between the two. I can see a 4-6 inch differential but to be completely off a 100yd target is just craziness. The prvi partizan 168bthp match ammo is supposed to be pretty good ammo. I know I shot some PMC XTAC 7.62 and then my GGG 7.62 and they were quite similar but I believe they are Nato spec clones so they should be similar.

[hpiguy]

Originally Posted by stevejr

Do they have the Ballistic information listed on your boxes? How was your point of impact different from your point of aim with the Federal ammo? I know you weren't on paper but how big were your targets? I'm curious to know if it's just a velocity issue or if the BC of the bullets are wildly different between the two. I can see a 4-6 inch differential but to be completely off a 100yd target is just craziness. The prvi partizan 168bthp match ammo is supposed to be pretty good ammo. I know I shot some PMC XTAC 7.62 and then my GGG 7.62 and they were quite similar but I believe they are Nato spec clones so they should be similar.

Steve, I don't recall the ballistic info being on the boxes, but I could be wrong. That's a great point though, the BC could be way off between the two. I didn't take the chronograph with me either. My spotter couldn't even see the hits in the dirt with the Federal, even when zoomed out for a wider FOV. My guess is the Federal was going over the 100yd berm if I had to guess.

Full disclosure though, I was shooting a five spot target that is fairly small (I'll check the size when I get home later but likely 16x16") so on a larger target it might have been fine. We're headed down to the hunting property soon, so we just decided to conserve ammo and wait. Everything will be different there environmentally anyway, and we'll need to start from square one just to be sure.

[JatoTheRipper]

[QUOTE=hpiguy;5855614]Spent most of the day at the range today. The Tikka was flawless, as expected. The M5 was tight at first, had some failure to feed early on. But after 20 or so rounds, a couple cleanings (I have my own method for new guns, YMMV) and some extra lube, she ran great. The Tikka will of course be the precision gun of the two, but damn that M5 is really fun to shoot! I can see how it could get expensive in a hurry banging steel not going for groups. Both brakes worked very well, the M5 is probably the softer to shoot of the two. Makes sense, it's a good 3lbs heavier and a gas gun to boot. My buddy claims the VG6 brake is roughly eleventy thousand percent worse to sit next to for spotting, the Strike Industries brake doesn't phase him. We were nice today and warned everybody, these will be LOUD!

Marked all my brass, and sorted by weapon it was fired from for fire formed brass.

What's the point of marking your brass? Is that for reloading or did you want to see how the brass looked after being fired?

Originally Posted by slowmethinks

I had an Officers Carry from RI. It was a turd from day one. It often jammed up with failure to fully chber a round. I tried different mags and it didn't fix the issue. Grease helped a little, but it didn't go away. Light polishing on the rails didn't help either. I dumped it.

Want a good 1911 for the money, Sig is where it's at. They have two variations, the classic 1911 slide and a slide with their signature horizontal shelf.

You can get a lot of nice goodies and sleek lines and finishes for under $1K.

That happens with all brands. From what I've read, heard, and experience it's not the norm with RI.

[hpiguy]

Yes sir, marking the brass is for reloading purposes.

[stevejr]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

What's the point of marking your brass? Is that for reloading or did you want to see how the brass looked after being fired?




That happens with all brands. From what I've read, heard, and experience it's not the norm with RI.

When you fire a new cartridge the explosion forms the brass into pretty much the exact size of that guns chamber. While both rifles are chambered in .308 win the chambers are not identical in size. That is why you mark your brass. If you want to get the most accuracy you can from a rifle you have to form your brass to the chamber you are trying to fire from. It is tedious work but worth it for accuracy seekers. You aren't getting 1/4 MOA 5 shot groups with factory ammunition generally speaking.

As to the RI 1911 mentioned earlier there were several other simple things that anyone can do that could have cured its issues. I would have polished the feed ramp if it had one after trying all the other things mentioned. If the feed ramp was either too small or at the wrong angle I'd have machined it properly. I would also have went to a heavier recoil spring.

Unfortunately we are spoiled by having most guns just work right out of the box. 1911s often don't and you have to tune them. It's part of the deal with them though.

My Sig 1911 (I posted a pic of it earlier in this thread but it's gone since I removed all my pics from Photobucket) gives me issues with plated bullets so even they have issues. I'll never buy independence ammo in .45acp again because of it. The ammo isn't bad it just doesn't cycle in my 1911. All the other ammo I've used does including my own reloads using Hornady XTP hollow point bullets

[hpiguy]

Steve summed it up way better than I could with limited time at work today. If I'm going to take the time and effort to reload, might as well take a few extra pains to get the absolute most you can out of your ammo. Even cheap plinking ammo will be more accurate with fire formed brass than not.

And Steve, the targets were 12" x 12". The issue is I was lazy, and was shooting one of these and had already shot the center bull, so I shot one of the corners. On a full target shooting for the center bullseye, I think it would have at least been on paper. The two rounds are within 50fps of each other, though the BC does differ slightly, .450 for the Privi, and .462 for the Federal GMM. I'll find out when I get time to get down to GA, with a fresh target. Learning the ins and outs of what each gun likes to be fed is part of the fun anyway.

[stevejr]

Originally Posted by hpiguy

Steve summed it up way better than I could with limited time at work today. If I'm going to take the time and effort to reload, might as well take a few extra pains to get the absolute most you can out of your ammo. Even cheap plinking ammo will be more accurate with fire formed brass than not.

And Steve, the targets were 12" x 12". The issue is I was lazy, and was shooting one of these and had already shot the center bull, so I shot one of the corners. On a full target shooting for the center bullseye, I think it would have at least been on paper. The two rounds are within 50fps of each other, though the BC does differ slightly, .450 for the Privi, and .462 for the Federal GMM. I'll find out when I get time to get down to GA, with a fresh target. Learning the ins and outs of what each gun likes to be fed is part of the fun anyway.

I agree with you on taking the extra time to do the extra work reloading for precision rifles. For general purpose shooting or training I'd reload for quantity. For hunting I'd try for something in the middle.

I don't know that much about reloading as I pretty much just follow the recipes in my Hornady manual. I have dies for every caliber I own but 2. I just haven't found the time to really get too much loading done and .223 is so cheap it isn't worth the effort right now.

I am glad to hear that the extreme difference in the way those two factory loads were shooting may in fact not be that extreme. I was honestly very curious about that. It just didn't seem like it should be that far off. I am by no means an expert shooter and I thought maybe I could learn some new stuff from your experience. Please keep posting your range reports from both rifles when you have the time. I enjoy them!

[hpiguy]

For banging steel I'll try to work up a cheap plinking load that both guns like. 1.5MOA will do for us out to 800yds at our private range. For hunting, I may just run store bought. It's honestly tough to beat Hornady SST Superformance. I'm still very green on the reloading, I've just been doing reading and research at this point and won't reload the first round until after hunting season most likely. Gotta make a GA trip soon to plant the food plots, so hopefully we'll get some trigger time then and I'll post more for sure.

I'm the same way, I'm always learning something from the rest of you, this is one of my favorite threads on RCC.

[JatoTheRipper]

I meant to put this post in this thread...

Holosun HS510C for my AR-15 build. I already have the Vortex Spitfire AR Prism scope so I'm going to see which I like best. I have an astigmatism that makes it tough to use some optics. After a bench test with the Holosun I'm very impressed.

Olight PL-Mini Valkyrie light for my M&P and Olight i1R EOS flaslight for my girlfriend's keychain since she goes to work before the birds are awake. Olight is a new name to me, but they were having a flash sale with deep discounts so I gave them a chance. So far I'm impressed with both lights. The keychain light is the brightest keychain flahslight I've ever seen and it's rechargeable!

[NoobCrawler]

https://www.sacbee.com/news/article215435310.html

Gonna toss this here. I’m not entirely sure I should be too excited about this, but seeing as it is the Ninth Circuit(even if it’s not the full board) it gives me a ray of hope. I’m sure CA will find a way to cancel it out though.

I don’t get out much, but I would sorta worry about open carrying here...I live in a very liberal area. But I also would like to carry if I could.

[hpiguy]

Not a fan of open carry for many reasons, but to each their own.

[NoobCrawler]

Originally Posted by hpiguy

Not a fan of open carry for many reasons, but to each their own.

Yeah, depending on your area, it could bring a lot of unwanted attention(it very well could anywhere really I suppose). I found the decision to be a hopeful stepping stone to getting our rights back, especially considering it’s the very liberal Ninth.

[Brake Weight]

I’m a firm believer in carrying a firearm, but legally. My state has an open carry and apparently always has. It’s just recently been clarified as to how it can be done. I got my concealed license, AKA Firearms Permit here, years ago and should have gotten it years earlier. I would suggest that every law abiding citizen do this no matter the hoops of legality must be performed to get it in your state. The world is becoming a crazy place. The tipper for me was a local restaurant was shot up the next day by a drunken patron that had gotten kicked out the evening before. No one was carrying that day in a crowed restaurant. All it takes is one CC to quell an imminent threat.

I do believe an open carry shouldn’t be nation wide and shouldn’t be another ‘right’. There are too many people out there without training nor range time to let roam about armed. Let alone those that have no fuse nor temperament to not use it when it’s not needed.

‘Big wins for gun owners everywhere’ can also lead to their demise. Like giving your kids enough freedom that they fail and you full knowingly allow/want this to happen just so you can prove a point and punish them for it.




Anybody shotty?

[stevejr]

Originally Posted by Brake Weight

I do believe an open carry shouldn’t be nation wide and shouldn’t be another ‘right’. There are too many people out there without training nor range time to let roam about armed. Let alone those that have no fuse nor temperament to not use it when it’s not needed.

‘Big wins for gun owners everywhere’ can also lead to their demise. Like giving your kids enough freedom that they fail and you full knowingly allow/want this to happen just so you can prove a point and punish them for it

I'm only quoting this portion of this post because I have no issues with the rest and for clarity as to what I'm debating against. I am not trying to argue just pointing out that on this we do not see eye to eye. I respect your right to your opinion but I want to make mine clear as well.

Let me preface my rant with this. I personally feel open carry is foolish and don't do it.


First of all the Constitution does not give people the right to own and carry firearms in the USA. It just recognizes that we were born with that right and guarantees it's protection. By definition, in the USA, I should be allowed to carry in any of it's 50 states in any manner I choose (open carry or concealed). That is how it should be. National Carry should be legal. Most states already have reciprocity laws but National Carry would make it easier so you don't have to look up different laws for every State you go to.

Saying someone should not carry because they don't have the right training, attitude, or whatever is wrong and their decision to make not yours or mine. It is the same argument that anti gun people use when they rant about civilians owning AR15s or standard capacity magazines (more than 10rds for those playing at home) and it nonsense. You and I may not want them to carry but that does not take away their (I can't think of a better term so please forgive me if this offends) God given and constitutional right to do so. And because it normally comes up in these conversations yes I believe if you can afford it you should be allowed to own it. "It" being whichever thing you want to insert in the sentence (machine guns, silencers, artillery pieces, tanks, etc). You can afford it you should be allowed to own it.

Freedom is scary and to be free like we were meant to be you have to take the good with the bad regardless of feelings. There are always going to be crazy people who slip through the cracks and bad guys with guns. Neither of these things should have any effect on legal law abiding gun owners.

[winnerone23]

Very well worded stevejr..

I live in the hills of PA. I open carry when it's proper.. Hiking, working at my dad's (lives on top of a mountain, with no neighbors), etc...
I don't go into town, the movie theater, Wal-Mart, etc and open carry.
It has its place.. It's a hassle, to open carry...
PA is a open carry state. (Most of it) Excluding Philadelphia. I don't think you can even conceal carry, in Philly.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

[NoobCrawler]

Originally Posted by Brake Weight

I’m a firm believer in carrying a firearm, but legally. My state has an open carry and apparently always has. It’s just recently been clarified as to how it can be done. I got my concealed license, AKA Firearms Permit here, years ago and should have gotten it years earlier. I would suggest that every law abiding citizen do this no matter the hoops of legality must be performed to get it in your state. The world is becoming a crazy place. The tipper for me was a local restaurant was shot up the next day by a drunken patron that had gotten kicked out the evening before. No one was carrying that day in a crowed restaurant. All it takes is one CC to quell an imminent threat.

I do believe an open carry shouldn’t be nation wide and shouldn’t be another ‘right’. There are too many people out there without training nor range time to let roam about armed. Let alone those that have no fuse nor temperament to not use it when it’s not needed.

‘Big wins for gun owners everywhere’ can also lead to their demise. Like giving your kids enough freedom that they fail and you full knowingly allow/want this to happen just so you can prove a point and punish them for it.


]

I will admit, my hope with this win was pretty selfish & just thinking how it would affect CA. I haven’t looked, but I’m sure open carry is illegal here. I’ve only looked into concealed carry.

There is no legal hoop I can jump through in order to get myself a concealed carry permit. I have to prove that I am under threat. So, yay me...I get to walk around just waiting to become a victim. Now, I don’t get out much, but aside from school, I semi regularly go to the usual targets for shooters, restaurants, movie theatres, church. I’m not in any way a paranoid person. I’ve lived 37 years without being threatened by someone with a gun. But I am aware of the world around me. As the saying goes, I’d rather have it & not need it than need it & not have it. Too bad that isn’t enough for the Sherriff...

[Brake Weight]

@stevejr

You are correct and I do agree. My issue with an across the board gun right is the fact that I know the direction this country is going. If they were to pass this and then there’s a rash of mass murder shootings. What would happen? This is my only concern. I do not trust the society we live in to mass carry arms. Yet I do not worry that every vehicle I pass on a 2 lane road will want to play chicken. I don’t think society is suicidal but are inherently homicidal.