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Thread: Is this a crawler motor for the C.C. ?

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Old 04-03-2009, 01:34 PM   #101
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I was at a hobbytown in dallas today, and came across these motors
3-9v 360 sized on the back it said torque was 79 at 7 volts, but i cant remember the unit of measure, :-( and the website has 0 info just a picture:-(

http://www2.stevenshobby.com:5641/



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Old 04-03-2009, 01:57 PM   #102
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Sounds like the 540 approach would be the easiest way to solve this, no? Get a 65 or 75T motor and be done w/ it, right?
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Old 04-04-2009, 07:21 PM   #103
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540's are large dia, so you must run about a 23T, to increase the pinion diameter and pull the 540 CAN away from the axle case.
23T will reduce the ratio from about 28(ish):1, to about 13:1. So you would need a HIGH turn 540, and run it on 4 or 5 cells to keep the speed down.
Then there is the length. It will take some link mount changes to make it fit.
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Old 04-04-2009, 08:58 PM   #104
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Approx. what rpm would you suggest the motor be at if running a 23 tooth pinion?
HH has some $6 motors that are 620KV (rpm/volt) that are 540 size.
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Old 04-04-2009, 09:48 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb View Post
This should really bake your noodle.

https://www.cermark.com/products/Cob...13-turns).html
In an ongoing attempt to talk to myself here, here is a pic of one of these motors installed. As with any cobalt mag motor in this application, link/shock attachment to axle is an issue that must be worked around. High-centering the upper links, or torsion susp will both eliminate this concern.
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Old 04-05-2009, 10:16 AM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb View Post
In an ongoing attempt to talk to myself here, here is a pic of one of these motors installed. As with any cobalt mag motor in this application, link/shock attachment to axle is an issue that must be worked around. High-centering the upper links, or torsion susp will both eliminate this concern.
I'm listening brotha, Have you had a chance to run it up! Does it feel like the answer?
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Old 04-05-2009, 11:33 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr Glassman View Post
Does it feel like the answer?
I have no idea, but for $10 a motor, sure seems worth attempting.

It will be awhile before this rig is up and running..........I REALLY shouldn't be spending any money on this stuff right now.
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Old 04-05-2009, 01:02 PM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robb View Post
I have no idea, but for $10 a motor, sure seems worth attempting.

It will be awhile before this rig is up and running..........I REALLY shouldn't be spending any money on this stuff right now.
Tell me about it! A bad economy and I'm in the middle of 4 build-ups
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Old 04-05-2009, 02:18 PM   #109
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For $10 it would be nice if they were the answer. Anybody else try these yet? Or have any thoughts?
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Old 04-05-2009, 03:09 PM   #110
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what size shaft on those? ive got a torsion chassis already built.
have you tested speed/torque on 7.2v yet?
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Old 04-05-2009, 05:51 PM   #111
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I haven't cracked the gearcase on mine open to measure the gears, but what about having some 48 pitch gears (or at least a 48 pitch 'spur') made to fit the gearcases? Smoother mesh and would allow for standard pinions to be used. Somebody did this for one of the Tamiya cars years ago, I think the TL01.
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Old 04-05-2009, 07:12 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by STANG KILLA SS View Post
what size shaft on those? ive got a torsion chassis already built.
have you tested speed/torque on 7.2v yet?
Shaft is typical 1/8".

All no-load, on 6-cell NIMH (@ 8.1v), I read about 21K, and with 3C Lipo (@ 12.3v), I read about 34K. I would guess that to be in the 2700-2800 kv range.

I don't have any means of measuring torque.

I did notice the little bugger get quite hot while running at 12v. For my build, I think I will look into 7.2v saddle packs, or 2C Lipo.

Last edited by Robb; 04-05-2009 at 07:15 PM.
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Old 04-05-2009, 08:40 PM   #113
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could you do the same data collecting on the stock setup?
dual batterys plus stock motor and post the exact voltage and rpm like you did above?
that could help us in our search to compare the two.
huge thanks
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Old 04-05-2009, 09:06 PM   #114
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Unfortunately, it has been so long since I have used a 7.2 pack, I can only find one around the shop, so I can't test a 14.4v setup.

Using the same parameters as above though, the stock motor produces about 4700 RPM @ 8.1v, and 7600 RPM @ 12.3v. This would average out in the ballpark range of 600kv.

The 13T Cobalt is definitely a bit faster. I need to do a little research on how to rig up some sort of cheap [ballpark] torque meter. It has caught my interest as well.
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Old 04-06-2009, 06:45 AM   #115
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hmm well its faster but faster usually means less torque. interested to see more testing, thanks for doing the second test!

for a simple torque meter what about a small digital scale, stood up against a wall and place the rig (front axle) against it and slowly apply throttle and watch for the pound/oz reading? we do something similar to this with planes to get a thrust reading.
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Old 04-06-2009, 08:00 PM   #116
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The 400 long can motors from banebots are the 14.4V answer. You only need to mount the upper links on the outside of the axle bracket, and they fit perfectly. Testing was done with 2.2" M3 compound Flat Irons, 11T vendetta (machined vs crap metal) pinions, and a traxxas EVX-2, no drag brake, but with a 2.5 amp, 6.0V BEC, it makes my servos happy. I could not make them stall in any situation. The gears started stripping long before I gave it full throttle while holding the truck still. Even using a radio without throttle expo, power was smooth, linear, and easy to control. Dial down your endpionts a bit, and you're set. This concludes my 14.4V testing, and I am VERY satisfied with the performance on the rocks. On 7.2V, the same setup was pretty darn good, speed is perfect, motors stall if you get a tire wedged, but still more than enough torque to push the back end over obstacles. Performance seems really close to my 110 turn handwound motors in my daughter's CC, but without the rewinding. I am not sure it is possible to get satisfactory performance from 7.2V with such small motors, but I am going to try that next. Maybe rewinding the long cans.........

Last edited by spartacus_nuc; 04-06-2009 at 08:03 PM. Reason: more info
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Old 04-06-2009, 08:02 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spartacus_nuc View Post
The 400 long can motors from banebots are the 14.4V answer. You only need to mount the upper links on the outside of the axle bracket, and they fit perfectly. Testing was done with 11T vendetta (machined vs crap metal) pinions, and a traxxas EVX-2, no drag brake, but 2.5 amp, 6.0V BEC makes my servos happy. I could not make them stall in any situation. The gears started stripping long before I gave it full throttle while holding the truck still. Even using a radio without throttle expo, power was smooth, linear, and easy to control. Dial down your endpionts a bit, and you're set. This concludes my 14.4V testing, and I am VERY satisfied with the performance on the rocks. On 7.2V, the same setup was pretty darn good, speed is perfect, motors stall if you get a tire wedged, but still more than enough torque to push the back end over obstacles. Performance seems really close to my 110 turn handwound motors in my daughter's CC, but without the rewinding. I am not sure it is possible to get satisfactory performance from 7.2V with such small motors, but I am going to try that next. Maybe rewinding the long cans.........
Is there a 14.4 esc that has a drag brake?
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Old 04-06-2009, 08:35 PM   #118
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*****WARNING*****


Super non-scientific, non Bill Nye, non Mr Wizard, half drunk guy listening to loud music experiment to follow!!

So for poops and laughs, I rigged up my postage scale on my work bench, then jerry rigged a wood clamp to hold motors, and then found a random piece of aluminum on the floor, and thought for sure I could measure something having to do with torque with this.

Main test was to compare the stock Cliff Climber motor against the $10 13T Cobalt motor. Both were set up exactly the same, and both supplied with 8.4V with a 6 cell NIMH pack.

Stock CC
Lever (radius) length = 5.1875"
Force applied at stall = 1.0 oz
Torque = 5.1875 inch-ounce

$10 Cobalt Magnet 13T
Lever (radius) length = 5.1875"
Force applied at stall = 4.2 oz
Torque = 21.7875 inch-ounce


At this point, I had no idea what these numbers meant in any real life situation, so I felt the need to compare this data to a motor that I knew.........so I yanked an Axiom 45T out of my 7.5 lb OCM/BERG.
(this gets interesting here)

Axiom 45T 540
Lever (radius) length = 5.1875"
Force applied at stall = 4.9 oz
Torque = 25.4188 inch-ounce




Think you can't get any power out of a little 3/4XX motor at 7.2V?
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Old 04-06-2009, 08:55 PM   #119
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You all have been busy since I looked last. Progress across the board.

thanks for the persistance
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Old 04-06-2009, 09:43 PM   #120
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Robb when you get the Cobolts in your CC tell use how it runs. Matt
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