Del Monte's Losi Comp Crawler

[Del Monte]

Originally Posted by P1choco

You saw those too. I think they might be the progressives that aren't out and may never be. Could also be the 1.6 gray or 1.4 gold. I'm pretty sure they are the progressives though.

Jake, where did you get those upper shock mounts? And are you compressing the springs more the driver side to compensate for the weight imbalance?

Yeah, I'm still running a dual-rate springs in the back. I like them, but they are borderline too soft. I'm not sure if they're ever going to be produced, but I can look into it. I will also get some info on the 21.5 motor.

I'm running the springs compressed more on one side to make up for weight imbalance and/or slight differences in the shocks. I basically set it up so that when I compress the suspension by hand, both shocks respond the same and settle to the same height. Doing this seemed to make the rig a lot more predictable when I hammer it on long vertical climbs.

[Dxxcrawler]

I have run with Jake and his rig it's works as good as he said, dont hurt Jake was driving. great job Jake, see you Sat good luck as if you need it.

[grouser]

Originally Posted by Del Monte

I'm running standard foams that I cut about 1/4" out of the center diameter. I was going for a tire that is stiff laterally, but conforms nicely. I'm happy with them.



A 12-14 tooth pinion works best with the 17.5. I loved the wheelspeed with the bigger pinions, but it just didn't have the torque and low speed control. I don't have my rig with me, but the shocks are cranked down probably 1/4-3/8th"

yes I have a 14t on now and it's greased lightning but a little to much for slow crawls,,,I can't think that fast!!!! So do ya think the 12t is low enouugh or did yo try it?

[Rubbaneck]

Look's great man. Do you have any pics of the battery tray without the battery on it? Also what is your belly clearance at ride height and full droop.

Thanks, keep up the good work.

[P1choco]

Originally Posted by grouser

yes I have a 14t on now and it's greased lightning but a little to much for slow crawls,,,I can't think that fast!!!! So do ya think the 12t is low enouugh or did yo try it?

I can't speak for Jake, but with my 17.5, I just switched from 14t to 12t. I loose wheel speed, but it gives me better torque and is more forgiving on the motor when in binds and doesn't run as hot.

[Del Monte]

Originally Posted by grouser

yes I have a 14t on now and it's greased lightning but a little to much for slow crawls,,,I can't think that fast!!!! So do ya think the 12t is low enouugh or did yo try it?

I went as low as 13 before I ran out of packs and daylight, and then I switched back to my 21.5 With the 13 tooth pinion, it wasn't much faster then my 21.5 on a 17 tooth pinion and the 21.5 had better low-end. The 17.5 crawled well and ran decently cool with the small pinions though. I would give a 12 a shot and see how it works for you.

With this rig, I prefer a slower driving style anyway. Wheelspeed can only get you so far, but driving technique can take you a long ways. Still, there are some places where it doesn't hurt to have extra power

[grouser]

Thanks for the help. I too like to take it slow and never really understood the need for speed,,untill I got a little and saw how in some places it's the ONLY way to get over something,,,I want it all I guess.

[wrightcs77]

Originally Posted by Del Monte

Heavy Setup
10oz. added in the front/45wt. shock oil
4oz. added in the rear/35wt. shock oil

Light Setup
6oz. added in the front/35wt. shock oildf
2.5 added in the rear/30wt. shock oil

I've been doing a lot of experimenting with tire weight and shock oil combinations lately, and this is what I've found works best. I've been using my heavy setup in high-traction areas (Grantie, slickrock, etc...) and using the lighter setup in slippery river rock areas. For extreme vert. climbs and big breakovers I've been using the heavy fronts with the light rears for some extra forward weight bias.

I'm also running both of my upper links in the top holes on the chassis. I like having a little extra squat in the rear suspension on verticals, but if you drive with a little heavier throttle, you may want to move your rear upper links down to the center hole.

I assume the wieghts posted are for each wheel?

Doesn't running the upper links higher on the chassis make the chassis reaction a little firmer?

[P1choco]

Originally Posted by wrightcs77

I assume the wieghts posted are for each wheel?

Doesn't running the upper links higher on the chassis make the chassis reaction a little firmer?

There's a few things to factor in. What kind of springs you are using and their angle. Laying them down should soften them up.

[Del Monte]

Originally Posted by wrightcs77

I assume the wieghts posted are for each wheel?

Doesn't running the upper links higher on the chassis make the chassis reaction a little firmer?

Correct, that's weight per wheel.

Raising the upper links changes the squat/anti-squat in the rear and dive/anti-dive in the front. It should also eliminate some chassis roll. P1choco is right though, shock angles and springs and oil play a big part in this too

[paystin]

Originally Posted by Del Monte

I've been competing and doing quite well with my out-of-the-box Losi comp crawler, but there were a few things that I noticed that would really help its performance.

First, I love the convenience of the battery tray, but I wanted the battey weight lower. My 3S lipos are pretty light, but for a comp rig you want as little sprung weight as possible. I cut out a lexan tray and moved my battery down to the upper links.



Next, I wanted to outboard the rear shocks to help reduce body roll. I grabbed a long 4-40 bolt and an extra rod end, and moved the shock to the outside of the mount.



This changes the shock angle and creates a bind at the upper shock mount, so I added 4 small washers behind the upper shock mount.



So far these two mods made a big difference in the rig's crawling ability. Its pretty scary now I can't wait for my chance to put it up against the best in the world over the summer...

Thanks for the tip on the suspension setup. I moved mine how you have it in the pictures and eliminated the few rollovers that I had before. I am also running the Losi yellow springs in the back witch might help a little as well.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Del Monte

Yeah, I'm still running a dual-rate springs in the back. I like them, but they are borderline too soft. I'm not sure if they're ever going to be produced, but I can look into it.

would you know the spring rate of the heaviest part?

[Del Monte]

Originally Posted by Robbob

would you know the spring rate of the heaviest part?

I'm not positive on the rate, but the soft rate feels really close to a Gray Losi spring (1.6), and the stiffer rate feels about like a Losi Yellow(2.0). Basically, its softer then a Losi white spring for the first half, then stiffer in the second half.

I did a little more experimenting today, and put Losi 45wt. oil in both the front and rear shocks. With my front shocks layed down all the way, and the rears in the middle hole on the arm, the rig was awesome. Super predictable, smooth, and planted everywhere. The suspension reacts pretty slowly with the 45wt, but I didn't feel that it was too slow anywhere. Again, this was on some pretty grippy granite, so I didn't need to use a ton of wheelspeed. I would probably stick with the lighter oil if I was going to run on slippery stuff.

I'm going back out tomorrow, so I'll grab some action pics and maybe a little video

[P1choco]

What's your ride height with the changes to the shocks?

[Nabil]

great job on this jake! i know this is making the lives of alot of losi owners easier

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Del Monte

I'm not positive on the rate, but the soft rate feels really close to a Gray Losi spring (1.6), and the stiffer rate feels about like a Losi Yellow(2.0). Basically, its softer then a Losi white spring for the first half, then stiffer in the second half.

Thanks.

[JPH Racing]

Del Monte: What's your cure for the lower links at the chassis popping off all the time? I've heard about the o-ring trick, but I'd rather find a solution that does not bind the suspension at all.

[AreCee]

Slip a washer on that is larger than the ball. If it pops off the washer holds the link in place. I had to do this with the Losi XXX-T.

[roksloski]

Originally Posted by JPH Racing

Thanks for posting up the inof and pics, this will be a big help to everyone.

Can you please discuss a little about your driving style with the LCC. How it differs from rigs you've driven in the past?

I would also like to hear more on this also.......

thanx

[Del Monte]

Originally Posted by roksloski

I would also like to hear more on this also.......

thanx

I've really slowed down my driving style with this rig compared to my TLT's. With a little weight in the tires and some shock tuning, I feel that this rig can crawl just about anything that my old rig had to power up.

Compared to my old Banana TLT rigs, my Losi has a ton more suspension travel. I can really move slowly and let the rig soak up everything. My ride height is still between 2 1/4 and 2 1/2", so I can still climb and sidehill great. I've been running full standard foams with a little trimmed off the inside diameter, and this really helped keep the tires from folding in the off-camber stuff. My original Top Banana rigs sidehilled a little better because they were so low, but the Losi is tons better all around.

I'll get some good comparison videos up when I have a chance to get out and shoot video