on the Creeper wagon,,,,

[rmdesignworks]

No problem brother,,I hope that helps.

[TLZ]

Wow, this build is very inspiring! You have made me remember why I got into this hobby in the first place!... Well, after I realized wrenching was more fun then driving after I broke my first A-arm!

Thanks to you I am craving a crawler again, and I think it might be some creeper that satisfies my hunger

You've got a PM about a question I have...

-Zane

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by TLZ

Wow, this build is very inspiring! You have made me remember why I got into this hobby in the first place!... Well, after I realized wrenching was more fun then driving after I broke my first A-arm!

Thanks to you I am craving a crawler again, and I think it might be some creeper that satisfies my hunger

You've got a PM about a question I have...

-Zane

Thanks Zane,,,heres the question you posed to me in your recent pm,,I thought I would post in hee seeing as it is an interesting question and hopefully a helpful answer...

TLZ
Newbie

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: SLO
Posts: 24


Re: Steering
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmdesignworks
Hey man, I love your creeper build... It really inspired me to buy a crawler! Hopefully I can sell a couple of my trucks and buy one soon!

Thanks Zane...Im glad you find the build that interesting and informative. I really strive to show what Ive done..some things work some dont.

I was wondering if you could run one steering servo per front wheel to enable cheaper, and possibly better steering.

You could however there are several problems that arise from using unlinked steering. One is the Ackerman angle and lazy wheel effect that happens when the wheels arent tied together with a tie rod. You dont want increased or decreased Ackerman angle, you want both tires always pointing in the same direction cuz we dont want the steering set up from a flat course truck on a crawler. Another issue is in binding,,if one wheel gets bound up a lighter weight servo wont be able to wiggle it free if it isnt tied with the other servo and to the other tire. My JR DS8711 servo is pricey at $140,00 USD but it can move the whole rig by itself and point my sticky Rovers where I want them to go.

It seems as if a lot of the issues that you were running into regarded steering, and if you ran one servo per wheel you would remove the steering linkages and open up all that space for further dabbling with suspension, and battery or electronics mounting. You would also be able to run cheaper servos and bring down the overall cost of electronics (two 645s?).

You could use two 645's together if they were linked together with a tie rod between them, but you wouldnt like the effects of indiviual steering servo's. It has been done by several people and it just doesnt work right. Plus my DS8711 has a 3 year replacement warranty,,if it fails I send it back and get a new one. My clearance issues came from fabricating more than just the steering too. I moved my battery to the axle...something the Creeper isnt designed for. The problems Ive had also gave me the insight for what parts are needed to overcome these issues. Im a designer...this is what I do.

I am just wondering why no body has done this yet, and what any possible problems with it would be.

As I stated above,,,plenty of people have done it but it just doesnt work. The two whels need to be tied together with a drag link. Yhere is a guy in our local crew that has an Axial with dual 645's on his rig,,they are linked toether to give the power to steer on a budget. But,,,he also has more weight where the battery could have been.

Thanks for you time,
Zane

I hope this answers your questions Zane...Let me know if there is anything else you nedd answered.

Thomas

Ps: you might consider posting your questions in my build thread cuz Im sure others are wondering the same things and this could help someone else.

In fact if you dont mind,,Ill copy this pm into my build thread. That way it can continue and others can ring in as well. Let me know.

[nightcrawler1984]

thomas this is a awesome thread now u need to do a losi crawler build. u are one of the best people that does full on build threads. and u help people out when they need it. also nice looking rig brotha

[rmdesignworks]

Thanks man,,nice of you to say so. I do what I can. I have my moments like anyone else but I try to remember this is a hobby and not to take myself too seriously but I cannot help it when it comes to information...my wife refuses to ask me questions cuz she hates the dictionary style answers she gets from me.

The Creeper will be getting some serious wheel time here real soon, several good comps coming up here in Colorado. I wont be able to attend the Red Rocks comp this weekend but there is a large one coming up on natural terrain that will be the first real test of my set up...natural rock just treats every crawler different I think. Should have serious turnouts at these too.

Oh and on the Losi idea,,Im not real big on worm drives unless I was to get the aftermarket gear set one of the RCC members' makes. And I would have to do it brushed as I just dont care for brushless, so some serious modding would be taking place too. But then,,,whats new?

[rmdesignworks]

I might as well post this up as well. I made a diagram of how the HR lock outs get installed and how everything goes together.

[nightcrawler1984]

love my night crawler but when i get into a hobby i get into it to the fullest i cant have anything that i can mod stock. i trying to figure out how to get my crawler to do vert climbs without going moa. i dont know if i am rushing things i have read alot of threads and tryed some of them but havent seen any difference in my crawler i dont know if its cus i am playing at home dealing with dirt sand and rocks to climb.

[rmdesignworks]

do you have a Creeper too?

[nightcrawler1984]

no but after reading ur thread i wish i did

[rmdesignworks]

i dont remember if i asked you but do you have a build thread for it?

[nightcrawler1984]

its all stock except for rover tires and 9 ounces of weight in each front tire

[rmdesignworks]

ok,,then let me get a look at a stock one online like at losi.com and ill see what i can see to help you out.

[nightcrawler1984]

Sounds good me

[catzuk]

Originally Posted by rmdesignworks

I might as well post this up as well. I made a diagram of how the HR lock outs get installed and how everything goes together.

This is good! Thanks for posting. Seems like there has been a lot of questions about this lately. It should be posted in the tips and tricks section, added to the first page!

[Karl]

Originally Posted by rmdesignworks

Karl,,hopefully this will help,,,

Thanks! Visuals help the most for me

[HwnElf]

Great diagram for them rear lockouts. Didn't really know where to put those shims. Now I'll have to go check and see if I installed it like that.

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by HwnElf

Great diagram for them rear lockouts. Didn't really know where to put those shims. Now I'll have to go check and see if I installed it like that.

Thanks man,,hopefully it helps someone or several someone's.

I got some info from the machinist and he says the first week of August is the majic hour for RMDW Vulture chassis'

[rmdesignworks]

After a lot of looking for what I want and not finding it...and a little debate over an email I received from a friend about my avatar and logo I have decided to go for a more old school, old time looking logo. Something you might see in an ad in a vintage magazine or show/movie.

What do you guys think?

[rmdesignworks]

I re-weighted my Creeper this afternoon. I took the rope weights I had on the axle housings off and removed the wheels disassembled the wheels/tires/foams and put in tape weights,,,6.0oz in each front and 3.0oz in each rear,,it feels much better as far as the weight bias is concerned,,,gotta get a bit of wheel time on it to know for sure. I also really need to get an RTR weight on this thing. I also removed the FLEX skid and have cut a new full length one to go on after weight testing. The new FLEX skid will go from axle to axle and close off all the openings under the Creeper making for nothing to get hung up on. It will take a bit to see if the new skid really works but the indications from the first one is that it really works well. You can tell by the scratches and wear in the material.

[rmdesignworks]

Who would have thought there would be that much difference between having weight on the axle housings and having them in the wheels. Damn, what a difference in performance. I was running the Creeper so freakin hard testing last night I got the lipos warm and the 55t hot,,,for the first time ever. Ya gotta love 3S!

First observation,,,I have a bit too much weight in the front wheels. Climbing over breakovers and having the front wheels fall to get traction was excellent however the rig wants to nose over on 50+ degree down hills. Forward bite uphills are sick though. Im gonna remove probably an ounce from each front wheel making them 5.0 oz. per wheel instead of 6.0 oz. Sidehilling was improved a bit but not by an incredible amount.

Second observation,,,I had removed the Flexible Skid from the front end so that I could really watch the suspension work. The Flexible skid is an ABSOLUTE MUST. The first thing I noticed was how easily the Creeper tranny got hung up after having the Flex Skid on for so long. Last nights testing was the key to seeing how invaluable the FLEXIBLE SKID really is.

The FLEX SKID is going back on.

Third observation,,,The modified rear lower links that I straightened the forward bend on to make them into HIGH clearance links,,,,they freakin work,,,Another definite must do MOD. The re-bent links along with the adjusted high pinion angle in the rear let me climd some ledges that gave me trouble in the past. I suggest to all Creeper drivers to straighten the forward bend of the rear lower links on your Creepers and increase your rear pinion up angle to match.