Ideas for next season Scale Series

[jason]

Originally Posted by lwb Sami

Would ya do it w/ worm drive axles, cause that's not very scale, never seen a worm drive axle under a truck on the trail. Once again, all I'm saying is scale is scale, dig transfer cases are in real trucks, worm drive axles are not. I'm new here and just trying to figure how you guys are coming up w/ scale or not.

I don't see many 1:1's driving around with giant electric motors in them either.

[Rubbaneck]

Originally Posted by lwb Sami

Well, in that case i can post a pic of VW bug w/ a electric motor hooked to the transaxle. Guy drives it every day to Manitou High School so I guess that means I can run berg axles in the scaler class. I'l see ya at the next comp!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure i can get my berg axles under my Hilux

Run what ya brung, toy trucks make me laugh.

[lwb Sami]

I'm just saying but how about a PRIUS, electric transaxle, work on a couple a week

Whens the last time you saw a 1916 anything going down the road. My point is if you guys are gonna come up w/ rules at least make them realistic. I get it now, Worm gear axles and electric motor axles are scale and dig units are make believe, where have I been , my head must be in my ass. I think I'll stick to 1to1s when it comes to scale. See look at my avatar that's scale buddys, dig unit, ring and pinions and 4 wheels and tires.

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by lwb Sami

I'm just saying but how about a PRIUS, electric transaxle, work on a couple a week

Whens the last time you saw a 1916 anything going down the road. My point is if you guys are gonna come up w/ rules at least make them realistic. I get it now, Worm gear axles and electric motor axles are scale and dig units are make believe, where have I been , my head must be in my ass. I think I'll stick to 1to1s when it comes to scale. See look at my avatar that's scale buddys, dig unit, ring and pinions and 4 wheels and tires.

When's the last time you saw a prius on an off-road course?

And, other than the hurricane concept when's the last time you saw a dual motor off-road vehicle?

There are certain things done for practicality, as in electric motors vs. mini gasoline or diesel motors. I still don't see why not allow a 4WD/RWD transfer case though...

[lwb Sami]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

When's the last time you saw a prius on an off-road course?

And, other than the hurricane concept when's the last time you saw a dual motor off-road vehicle?

There are certain things done for practicality, as in electric motors vs. mini gasoline or diesel motors. I still don't see why not allow a 4WD/RWD transfer case though...

Let's get a sixpack and talk someone into letting us use their Prius and I'll show you a Prius offroad. I think we lost the point here.

1. Dig units are in real vehicles

Rubba commented how he's all for rws and digs in a sarcastic way, by the way Team Pro Baby, I'm just using Rubba as a example.

2 so that made me think about the fact that Rubba has worm drive axles, That truely isn't scale, no if, ands , or assholes about it. So I figured that would just be a good arguement aginst the dig factor

3 A dig is more scale then a worm drive axle, period.....

4 I was just kidding about the Berg, but the truth is I could argue it just as well as Rubba could his worm axles. I bought a Hilux and built a scaler just for the fact I wanted something really scale.

5 I'm done here, just trying to make a point, rules can be twisted into anything, but if your gonna call it a scaler, make it scale!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by lwb Sami

What he said

I sort of agree with you. An average off-road, street legal vehicle usually has a way to select between 4WD and RWD (transfer case), but they usually do not have a way to select between 4WD and FWD (Dig) however, someone can pull their e-brake and lock the rear wheels allowing their center diff to apply power to their front wheels.

I also agree in saying that worm gear axles aren't scale realistic in functionality. Imagine driving down the highway, and letting off the gas and the having the wheels lock up on you... Same can be said about drag brake though.

If you think about it though, an SCX10 is also just as "not-scale" (same with a hilux) with the motor mounted to the transmission in the center of the vehicle.

So taking all that in consideration, there are some things that are just not allowed since they are less "scale" than others.

My vote is to allow a 4WD/RWD transfer case, but keep the dig, RWS, and worms in the "unlimited" class.

[TURTLE]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

My vote is to allow a 4WD/RWD transfer case, but keep the dig, RWS, and worms in the "unlimited" class.

Totally disagree.

Leave the class the way it is and lets try an exhibition class for dig and four wheel steer.

There are a lot of new guys on RCC voicing their opinion here, which, don't get me wrong is nice to have a fresh voice, but I think they need to really attend some events and build a couple rigs before they get to vocal.

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by TURTLE

There are a lot of new guys on RCC voicing their opinion here, which, don't get me wrong is nice to have a fresh voice, but I think they need to really attend some events and build a couple rigs before they get to vocal.

Originally Posted by Rogue

In 2.2


...
Overall standings with one drop.
I just barely hung on to the lead in this class with a 5 point win over Jeff (JGoodall).

'nuff said...

[RPMJ]

Hey Monkeyracer, Turtle has built some of the best scalers on this forum. He is in the process of building something epic. Just because he didn't run this season much doesn't mean shit. Know your facts before you post something like this.......... have you ever heard of Macguyver (Turtle's old yota that I think 666 has now)

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by RPMJ

Hey Monkeyracer, Turtle has built some of the best scalers on this forum. He is in the process of building something epic. Just because he didn't run this season much doesn't mean shit. Know your facts before you post something like this.......... have you ever heard of Macguyver (Turtle's old yota that I think 666 has now)

I never said he couldn't build or drive.... he can... i was defending my building and my driving.

I only think my opinions should count as one vote, just as ANY other member of this forum. I think this should be a majority rules kind of thing. If the majority of guys want to run 4WD/2WD, then we should, but if the majority of guys don't, then we won't...

[Almighty Malach]

Originally Posted by monkeyracer

I never said he couldn't build or drive.... he can... i was defending my building and my driving.

I only think my opinions should count as one vote, just as ANY other member of this forum. I think this should be a majority rules kind of thing. If the majority of guys want to run 4WD/2WD, then we should, but if the majority of guys don't, then we won't...

Maybe you should just STFU and/or start your own damned scale series so you can run dig. I think Todd saying if you want dig run your comp rig should have been a big enough clue to leave it alone. Oh wait, you can't do that because you can't stand being right. You should really take a step back and evaluate what you want in this hobby and if its worth being an outcast for it.

[Rogue]

Ok, this got out of hand again
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Originally Posted by monkeyracer

Are we talking about front dig or rear dig?

I was planning on mounting my dig so it disconnects the front axle, similar to a lot of 1:1 vehicles that can select between 4WD, and RWD.

I can see banning the other style dig that disconnects and/or locks the rear axle for tighter turns, since this is not common in a "street legal" 1:1 vehicle, but the first style is very common in most 1:1 off-road vehicles.

If we do an unlimited class though, and allow Dig and rear steer, what would the other rules for that class be in terms of vehicle design?

I would think that most people that want dig would use front dig.
I think that if we were to start this class it would have to limit it to only one axle dig, front or rear. Banning other forms of dig would be pointless to even start a class then. To just to have 4x4 and RWD would be scale, but I could not see it improving scale comps. Trail rides it maybe cool to see how far you could get before having to "lock it in" but other wise it just painfull to watch a rig try to do anything once the front axle looses power.
Rules and vehicle design would need to be though out.

Originally Posted by RPMJ

Hello.............

I know you'd be there! Still working LONG hours and well you know we talked.

Originally Posted by Rubbaneck

I'll run a 1.9 dig/4ws class.

And I'll build a Axail 1.9 to run the street class too.

Cool! that's what I wanted to hear.
If there is going to be an unlimited class 1.9 and 2.2 would be thrown together. After a season of totaling and going over results, I really don't see a great advantage to either one, so I think it would work. I guess we could see here shortly!

Originally Posted by TURTLE

Totally disagree.

Leave the class the way it is and lets try an exhibition class for dig and four wheel steer.

There are a lot of new guys on RCC voicing their opinion here, which, don't get me wrong is nice to have a fresh voice, but I think they need to really attend some events and build a couple rigs before they get to vocal.

Ty your correct, this would not take place of any other class, it would be the last class to run and if time runs out, then time runs out.

The two established classes would take priority over this, unless overwhelming demand for it is present.

I think this could be a cool class, but I still want the focus to be on "scale" rigs. With an introduction of an "unlimited" class we are starting to step away from scale and closer to comp rigs. I really don't want to do that as we already have many great outlets for the true comp rig.

[monkeyracer]

Originally Posted by Rogue

I would think that most people that want dig would use front dig.
I think that if we were to start this class it would have to limit it to only one axle dig, front or rear. Banning other forms of dig would be pointless to even start a class then. To just to have 4x4 and RWD would be scale, but I could not see it improving scale comps. Trail rides it maybe cool to see how far you could get before having to "lock it in" but other wise it just painfull to watch a rig try to do anything once the front axle looses power.
Rules and vehicle design would need to be though out.

This makes some sense. I was planning on installing the dig, and locking it out for the comps, and unlocking it for fun... (Brake-standing burnouts?) I could see a very small number of situations where having no power to the front wheels could help get the vehicle pointed the right way, but again, only a very few number of situations.

Originally Posted by Rogue

I know you'd be there! Still working LONG hours and well you know we talked.



Cool! that's what I wanted to hear.
If there is going to be an unlimited class 1.9 and 2.2 would be thrown together. After a season of totaling and going over results, I really don't see a great advantage to either one, so I think it would work. I guess we could see here shortly!



Ty your correct, this would not take place of any other class, it would be the last class to run and if time runs out, then time runs out.

The two established classes would take priority over this, unless overwhelming demand for it is present.

I think this could be a cool class, but I still want the focus to be on "scale" rigs. With an introduction of an "unlimited" class we are starting to step away from scale and closer to comp rigs. I really don't want to do that as we already have many great outlets for the true comp rig.

Again, this makes sense. Keep the comp rigs at the comp events.
I think it would be cool to have an "unlimited" class though. There was a TTC TJ that I was considering building that has 4WS and Dig, but if I built it for the 2.2 class, I'd have just locked out both for the comps and unlocked it for when I'm just messing around on the rocks.


FWIW there's always going to be shit talking in any competitive event. That's inescapable. I can handle anything thrown at me because at the end of the day, I just want to have fun building and driving my toy truck. The scale events are a cool way to have fun with a group of guys with the same interest, learn something new, and take a step out of reality for a day. We don't need to bring high school into it. There's no 'Seniors vs Freshmen' anymore, we all get a say. When it comes down to it, we can decide democratically what to do. Todd, again, I'm sorry if I posted anything to detract from the thread.

I know there was talks about unlimited class rules before this series started, why don't we iron out some of the details? This may help me decide if I should build a 1.9 or an unlimited.

[engineerjoe]

Gentlemen, this is the scale series right? Isn't this supposed to be more fun than the comp series?

Take a step back, relax, take a sip of your favorite beverage and think about it. I was more worried about making my scaler look like something I would see on the streets everyday than I was about making it fit the rules so I could comp it. And it shows in the lack of capability of the rig.

Scalers are the "fun" side of rccrawling, so build it how YOU want it and if there's a class that you can run in then do it, otherwise, have fun driving it around outside of comps.

[TURTLE]

Originally Posted by lwb Sami

This is pretty normal for RCC. Alot of shit talking...

Originally Posted by TURTLE

Leave the class the way it is and lets try an exhibition class for dig and four wheel steer.

There are a lot of new guys on RCC voicing their opinion here, which, don't get me wrong is nice to have a fresh voice, but I think they need to really attend some events and build a couple rigs before they get to vocal.

Where did I say your opinion is crap? I guess text can be a matter of interpretation on occasion, but generally direct word usage is involved.
You are getting a little worked up, over nothing. Casey is justified, this isn't the first time for issues with the monkey, in fact its far from the first time.

Im not shit talking Im stating my opinion.
You want some background on my newb status?
Running in the colorado series since 2006, started the colorado summer series with 666 in 2007 and have been running them since with 666 (I took part of a season off in 08'). Started talk of beginning a scale series in 2007 (shortly after Mike started one). Have built seven different scalers over the course of the last four years, with 3 more in the works. And I have had countless comp rigs in 2.2 and super class, I have attended and ran national events. I have worked for RCDriver on multiple occasions, been to full size events and been 1:1 wheeling for the last ten years. Should I keep going?

[THnCS]

Originally Posted by engineerjoe

Gentlemen, this is the scale series right? Isn't this supposed to be more fun than the comp series?

Take a step back, relax, take a sip of your favorite beverage and think about it. I was more worried about making my scaler look like something I would see on the streets everyday than I was about making it fit the rules so I could comp it. And it shows in the lack of capability of the rig.

Scalers are the "fun" side of rccrawling, so build it how YOU want it and if there's a class that you can run in then do it, otherwise, have fun driving it around outside of comps.

Thanks Joe!!!

Personally could care less. I have always seen it this way.
1.9 is the scale class-- this is based off trucks that you buy from a dealer. NOt a full offroad vehicle, dig as far as I know it is not a factory option. On the other hand 4ws is. My boss has a GMC 2500 with the quad steer option. Damn thing turns tighter than my Trailblazer.

2.2 is more of a trail offroad rig. Something that is towed or driven to crawl. Bigger tires and tube work. More of a custom type deal. Now you get into dig and 4ws in this class. I have ridden in rigs that have both, Dan's old blazer had cut brakes for each rear wheel.

Me, I see the classes like the above but have no problems with the current rules. Been running it that way for the last 3-4 yrs that I have been involved in it. IF there is a class that allows dig in a 2.2, Lets do it. IF it is still not allowed, Lets do it!! Just let me know.

Like Joe said, no reason to get into pissing contests over scale RC's. I think people try to analize it to death. A RC car will never be scale to its 1:1, too many differences. The rules are fine the way they are. IF we want to do an unlimited class or something with dig, let's try it out!! Leave it at that!!

I could care less, I just want to play with my toy truck.
Turtle/Casey Love Ya

[lwb Sami]

Originally Posted by THnCS

Turtle/Casey Love Ya

I agree, sorry had a bad mourning

[Rogue]

The dumbest thing about all of this is something that may or may not even come about. I asked if there was interest, and this crap is what evolved. All that was really needed from anyone was to show their interest in building one. Not defining what is or is not scale. There are no guidelines to even build one right now, I/we would need to come up with all of that.

Who has the most knowledge or been here the longest has absolutely no reason to be part of this thread either. If that were important and we want to play that game I guess I would be better off then anyone but Jason who has posted in this thread. I was the 6th person to join this site, two of the members are the same person and the other is his wife I could list all of the crap I have done with other things in my life too but does it really matter, I really don't think so.

All I have been trying to do with these threads is to get some input on what they would like to see. The last question was to see who would have interest in building one.
I can now see why the USRCCA does not ask for the general publics ideas on what the rules for each class should be. They come up wtih the rules, and you run what they have defined or you don't. With these threads it seems everyone has to argue what their ideas are, then see who has the biggest keyboard. There have been some good ideas and opinions expressed, but the bickering does nothing for anyone. IF anything it make us as a goup look like dumb asses.

I have really enjoyed running and love being at the events. I have a great time talking and hanging out with everyone, but the crap that has been going on in this thread make me wonder why. I also question if you all were to show up at an event would we play with toy trucks or hold a WWF event.

For now though, I'll come up with some guidelines for what and unlimited class could be. Post up if your willing to build something that could fit into something that were to be unlimited.
Pretty vague but 1.9/2.2 tires and wheels max 5.5", must run full body or tuber with panels, (not really any different then the rules now) must have drive shafts, can have 4WS DIG front or rear, but limited to one axle only. Would need a winch period, no exceptions. Courses would be built were a winch would have to be used at least once. There would be no assistance from any other rigs at any time with this class. I can come up with a full list here in the next few days and we'll see if it is something that we would event want to try.

Please just post up if this is some thing that your interested in, not anything else. All I want to know if this is something that is possible and worth taking the time to set up.

Thanks, Todd.

[Rubbaneck]

Originally Posted by Rogue

I'll come up with some guidelines for what and unlimited class could be. Post up if your willing to build something that could fit into something that were to be unlimited.
Pretty vague but 1.9/2.2 tires and wheels max 5.5", must run full body or tuber with panels, (not really any different then the rules now) must have drive shafts, can have 4WS DIG front or rear, but limited to one axle only. Would need a winch period, no exceptions. Courses would be built were a winch would have to be used at least once. There would be no assistance from any other rigs at any time with this class. I can come up with a full list here in the next few days and we'll see if it is something that we would event want to try.

Thanks, Todd.

I like it. Keep up the fine work Todd, your doing a great job!

[R2j]

Well said Todd. I would build something for this class. Sounds fun, but I wouldn't want it to detract from the scale series itself. That's what we're all doing there, just would be a fun bonus.