SORCCA rules comments, suggestions, and questions

[justinart24]

Originally Posted by joeyf

now im in trouble.

Yeah...I am going to have to.....go ahead and.....spend some more time teching in your truck next comp.....yeah....that would be great.

[sally1800]

Originally Posted by War Pig

A quick shot of the new IROK compared to the M/T TTC and Bogger



Looks to be exactly the same height to me. That'll make it easier....

Those guys are fat....

That IROK does looks shaved enough to me. Run it.

Tim do you see my point? How or why would you think that IROK right out of the bag will not work? "size on the side means nothing for class 3"

You can easily see if a lug was removed.

No one will ever be able to prove there not shaved enough.

Do you not feel that if Sorcca doesn't adapt this new tire there will be more problems then it's worth? I sure do.

[sally1800]

Originally Posted by sloppy

Everyone that is fascinated with pitbulls why is a open lug tire from a real manufacture that emulates a real tire any worse then a completely made up tire?? Like the axial ripsaws?? They are not a real tire they dont look like any real tire in the least, there are actually a couple comp tires that are on the banned list that look similar..

Are we supposed to ban every tire that deviates just a little from 1:1?? Because we would have to add some more tires to that list that are 100 % real..

And yes some 1:1 tires do have open lugs grooved in..

Can we build scale 4 wheelers? Rocker ll is the only open lug tire I see Pit Bull makes.

I do see the point on the other tire "Axial".

[team3six]

Wow, how the thread has since grown.

I think the concern about changing the size limit is a boundary limit.
Meaning, the ole saying " if you give em an inch, they will take a mile."


So if the rule is changed to adopt this tire in to fit the rules, then who is to say the next tire from someone is a fraction larger than the last? Now comes the issue " well you changed the rule for this, why not that?"


If you don't stick to a set of rules then there is chaos. And who wants another (jake rule bender) running around?


Maybe the correct way to handle this isn't to change the rules, but to add a limitation clause. ( not to exceed +0.?? ) this way it cleans up any misconception to any other tire.


On the subject of the pit bulls. Sloppy, I know of no open lug tire on the market! I know of slotted or slit grooved lugs, but not open lugs.
I understand the point of running them at the time, but just because pit bull made them doesn't warrant a reason for use!


And Tim, when they came out we were 2 of the first 3 to have them. I love the compound, I love the weight, but I hate the look! Yes they look like the original, but a skewed version. Even pit bull said they made them for dual purpose in comp and scale.

[Tommy R]

Originally Posted by saydee1800

Do you not feel that if Sorcca doesn't adapt this new tire there will be more problems then it's worth? I sure do.

So we should just increase the max legal tire size from 5.75" to 5.80" because RC4WD made a tire that happens to be that tall? Maybe when someone eventually comes out with a another "cool" tire that's 5.9", we can modify the rules, too? And then with 6.0, 6.1, 6.2, etc....until we're all running Super sized tires.

This tire size has been in place long enough. Clearly SORRCA rules were not a criteria for RC4WD when they created this tire or they would've considered them and made them fit within the clearly outlined rules. So they shouldn't be surprised or disappointed if they're not legal for SORRCA competition. I hate to say that, but it's true.

Originally Posted by ROCKEDUP RICKY

SORCCA doesn't need this tire or anything bigger in class 2- 3/4.

Why do you insist on breaking our balls with comments like that? Do you not understand any of the many points we're trying to illustrate here? We're trying to HELP explain things so everyone understands why these decisions were made. If you disagree, fine. State your peace, but please move on. Please don't simply clutter up this otherwise useful thread for no apparent reason. As it is, I'm on the Scale Committee, but I'm tempted to unsubscribe from this thread because I feel that all of this information if falling on the deaf ears of people who merely want to complain 'til they get their way.

And after spending countless (literally) hours working on these rules to come up with something fair for AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE, it's frustrating and discouraging to be involved to "discussions" like this. Anyone is welcome to be nominated to the committee. So if you feel so strongly about making changes......and are willing to put in the leg work.......speak up to join the committee.

Again, please feel free to bring up valid points, but can we please keep this discussion constructive?

[sloppy]

Originally Posted by saydee1800

Can we build scale 4 wheelers? Rocker ll is the only open lug tire I see Pit Bull makes.

I do see the point on the other tire "Axial".

the rules dont seem to limit building any kind of vehicle.. Cars get built all the time, a rhino has been built locally.. And I have seen freaking ATV tires on sammys..

The rockers certainly came up when we discussed the tires, Not to mention real 1:1 tires do get lugs opened up on them when siping, I have seen both boggers and claws with open lugs..


Not to mention its not the only open lug tire thats not on the banned list.

Originally Posted by team3six

Wow, how the thread has since grown.

I think the concern about changing the size limit is a boundary limit.
Meaning, the ole saying " if you give em an inch, they will take a mile."


So if the rule is changed to adopt this tire in to fit the rules, then who is to say the next tire from someone is a fraction larger than the last? Now comes the issue " well you changed the rule for this, why not that?"
Exactly right Norm got 5 guys beating the drums for a tire.. Next it will be something else..


On the subject of the pit bulls. Sloppy, I know of no open lug tire on the market! I know of slotted or slit grooved lugs, but not open lugs.
I understand the point of running them at the time, but just because pit bull made them doesn't warrant a reason for use!
Where does it say that a tire has to be on the "market" I am aware of no rockwell axled VW bug on the market either but I certainly have seen them made in both 1:1 and scale.. I have also seen and I am sure if you use google you can find open lug siping on 1:1 tires..


And Tim, when they came out we were 2 of the first 3 to have them. I love the compound, I love the weight, but I hate the look! Yes they look like the original, but a skewed version. Even pit bull said they made them for dual purpose in comp and scale.

And if I recall another manufacture also calls some of their scale tires comp tires, is that dual purpose?? should we add them to the banned list? they are also not a perfect replication of their 1:1 counterpart.

And for goodness sakes if we go off of a "skewed version" being the cut off for scale tires, We would have to make a 2 page banned list, Half of RC4wd tires are skewed versions, so are other manufactures...

[sally1800]

Originally Posted by Tommy R

So we should just increase the max legal tire size from 5.75" to 5.80" because RC4WD made a tire that happens to be that tall? Maybe when someone eventually comes out with a another "cool" tire that's 5.9", we can modify the rules, too? And then with 6.0, 6.1, 6.2, etc....until we're all running Super sized tires.

This tire size has been in place long enough. Clearly SORRCA rules were not a criteria for RC4WD when they created this tire or they would've considered them and made them fit within the clearly outlined rules. So they shouldn't be surprised or disappointed if they're not legal for SORRCA competition. I hate to say that, but it's true.





And after spending countless (literally) hours working on these rules to come up with something fair for AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE, it's frustrating and discouraging to be involved to "discussions" like this. Anyone is welcome to be nominated to the committee. So if you feel so strongly about making changes......and are willing to put in the leg work.......speak up to join the committee.

I am sure there is a lot of work put into these rules. Yes I do agree with when is a tire "to Big" or "super size"

My point is if the New IROK is 5.8 and 5.75 is legal. It has been posted that IROK can be shaved .05 to become 5.75 then look what that is starting.

Take a lot a the picture War Pig posted these already legal as they look SAME as the baja. We all know these tire are never exact.

[johnnyh66]

Hey Rules Committee, you need a dad on the board!
Kids are always arguing the details for the sake of arguing, but dad holds the "Because I said so." trump card

[neillarson]

I think this has come down to semantics, It goes back to the same issue with the 2.2 Flatirons, the vendors have no clue how to measure the tires. Tim's pictures shows the Bogger (5.7"), the Claws (5.75") and the IRoks (5.8") are all the same size. A decision has been made to use the Manufactures specs when they are available and a standard measure when they are not. This was a good call on the rules committee even though I took it in the shorts for it, lol. I may not like the fact that I can't use IRoks but I am willing to go along with it to end this argument (in our club).

As has been said before, I will still buy them, I will still run them as it is my truck and I will do what I please. If I was ever invited to a SORRCA event, I would leave them at home until the rules committee says otherwise.

As to the Rules Committee, this is the second year that we (NIRC) have asked about representation from our area with no resolution. I understand that you want to keep the numbers down, but there are a few of us that are very interested in ensuring that our voices are heard. So what do we do? It has been said a couple times that there are openings that you want to fill. Saydee, Badhoopty, Die-Laughing, JohnnyH66 and myself have all been active in looking at and discussing the rules here and on our forum and I am sure that one of us would be able to fill one of the roles. Now I can't volunteer them but I have time and the desire to do this and would be willing to do it but, and a big but, I am a noob and I can't see getting past this "Nominating" process. Illinois may not be the meca of RC Crawling, but we manage to do well for ourselves and would like to asset in the process.

[ROCKEDUP RICKY]

Originally Posted by Tommy R

Why do you insist on breaking our balls with comments like that? Do you not understand any of the many points we're trying to illustrate here? We're trying to HELP explain things so everyone understands why these decisions were made. If you disagree, fine. State your peace, but please move on. Please don't simply clutter up this otherwise useful thread for no apparent reason. As it is, I'm on the Scale Committee, but I'm tempted to unsubscribe from this thread because I feel that all of this information if falling on the deaf ears of people who merely want to complain 'til they get their way.

And after spending countless (literally) hours working on these rules to come up with something fair for AS MANY PEOPLE AS POSSIBLE, it's frustrating and discouraging to be involved to "discussions" like this. Anyone is welcome to be nominated to the committee. So if you feel so strongly about making changes......and are willing to put in the leg work.......speak up to join the committee.

Again, please feel free to bring up valid points, but can we please keep this discussion constructive?

This has nothing to do with the tire, it has to do with math and the scale look in mine and others opinions.

I think you guys have did a great job with class 1 and class 2, but fall short in class 3.

Class-3 “Modified”
• Description - An off-road vehicle that you would build from the ground up and might see in a TTC/KOH type competition.


I was in the committee in the begainging, after being told to shut up and vote a couple times ,I decided not to waste mine time and removed myself. I wanted and others want a 6inch tire then. Somethings weren't even allowed to be voted on.

I love this sport and am in it for the long haul, But I 'll keep my opinions to myself and follow the rules. Guess I 'll build a 1/14 scale class 3 rig so I can be competitive.

[ROCKEDUP RICKY]

Specification:

• OD: 5.75"(146mm)
• Width:2.25"(57mm)
• Inner Diameter: 2.04"(52mm)
• Fit 2.2 wheel only
• Advanced X2 SS Compound (Super Soft & Super Sticky)

Game on.

[War Pig]

Originally Posted by ROCKEDUP RICKY

This has nothing to do with the tire, it has to do with math and the scale look in mine and others opinions.

Maybe we will have to figure out a simple way to keep the "correct scale" so Class 3 rigs look right (although "correct scale" and "looks right" is different in everybodies eyes....just look at the difference in rigs between the northwest, southwest and deep south). There's always some give and take in any set of rules, especially scale rules where there is so much diversity.



Class-3 “Modified”
• Description - An off-road vehicle that you would build from the ground up and might see in a TTC/KOH type competition.

Note the highlighted word above.....keep in mind that all Class 3 trucks don't have to be TTC rigs.




IGuess I 'll build a 1/14 scale class 3 rig so I can be competitive.

So it went from 1/12th scale to 1/14th scale.....always exaggerating to try to prove a point . You could just go build a 10th scale truck like 75% of the other people

[DISTURBIN' tha PEACE]

Originally Posted by ROCKEDUP RICKY

Specification:

• OD: 5.75"(146mm)
• Width:2.25"(57mm)
• Inner Diameter: 2.04"(52mm)
• Fit 2.2 wheel only
• Advanced X2 SS Compound (Super Soft & Super Sticky)

Game on.

It's all a moot point now.

[johnnyh66]

Squeaky wheel gets the greasing!

[War Pig]

I've had ongoing discussions with Tom at RC4wd and because the tire measures out at 5.76" mounted on a wheel (not 8.83" like he planned), he decided to modify the height on their website, and will be modifying the molds to say 5.75" on the tire sidewall. This should eliminate any confusion about this tire for the 2012 season. Tire size in Class 3 is on the discussion list for next year. Thanks, Tim.

[DISTURBIN' tha PEACE]

Originally Posted by War Pig

I've had ongoing discussions with Tom at RC4wd and because the tire measures out at 5.76" mounted on a wheel (not 8.83" like he planned), he decided to modify the height on their website, and will be modifying the molds to say 5.75" on the tire sidewall. This should eliminate any confusion about this tire for the 2012 season. Tire size in Class 3 is on the discussion list for next year. Thanks, Tim.

I woulda bought them either way.

We're so isolated, I don't think anyone cares what we do anyway.

[johnnyh66]

Originally Posted by War Pig

Tire size in Class 3 is on the discussion list for next year. Thanks, Tim.

just make sure to leave my beloved 2.2 Pit Bulls alone!

[War Pig]

Originally Posted by johnnyh66

just make sure to leave my beloved 2.2 Pit Bulls alone!

You're safe for this year!

[666]

Originally Posted by johnnyh66

just make sure to leave my beloved 2.2 Pit Bulls alone!

x2!

[Die-Laughing]

Originally Posted by 666

x2!

Eww.. you have those freak tires too!?