Future Options from Vanquish

[Natedog]

Great to hear Josh, did they raise and move the upper link mounts rearward? That would be nice to help with TT when used in conjunction with some type of RULR setup at the chassis. What else is in the pipeline?

[Harley]

Originally Posted by Natedog

Great to hear Josh, did they raise and move the upper link mounts rearward? That would be nice to help with TT when used in conjunction with some type of RULR setup at the chassis. What else is in the pipeline?

We did not move any rear link positions. Its a balance of keeping everything working with stock trucks and improving what we can. I'd love to be able to move stuff all around and fix everything possible, but we get reamed by most consumers for doing that and requiring extra parts to make it work.

I have a few other parts ready to go, but we also have to see how the Vaterra stuff will sell. If the market isn't popular for us, then how much effort do I put on it vs other new markets like the Losi rigs? We are a small shop, we only have so much capacity. I hope the Vaterra market is big and is just under visualized online.

[Natedog]

That's what I thought. Yes, unfortunately too many peeps don't want to even have to change a link or buy a couple longer screws to make a great modification.

Looking forward to all the VP Vaterra parts, thanks!

Edit: Forgot to say that I'm very happy to see you and Vanquish here with some sweet new Ascender parts!

[Natedog]

Been thinking about this, there are several reasons that non-Vaterra aftermarket parts sales for Ascender parts have not been as good as some vendors may have hoped for.

When the Ascender first released a bunch of peeps had diff gears break and plastic driveshafts twist off like licorice, everybody got scared and sold off their Ascenders for cheap, abandoning some really nice build threads here on RCC and elsewhere. Vaterra stepped up and very quickly released redesigned pinion gears with better metallurgy and thicker driveshafts made of stronger fiber reinforced plastic, fixing the two main problems. Vaterra also release a whole slew of very high quality machined aluminum parts for the Ascender at the same time the very well thought out and engineered truck was released, thus decreasing the need and consumer demand for aftermarket parts.

Stronger CVDs that can handle abuse with slipper locked down, 3S/4S lipos and brushelss motors and a TT (torque twist) solution were pretty much all that remained. Vaterra has beefed up their CVDs, now Vanquish has released VVDs, problem solved! I'm waiting for VP VVDs to be in stock to purchase for my trucks. TT has been almost eliminated with rear swaybars and RULR type rear link setups in conjunction with outboarded rear shocks.

We have been mostly ignored for over two years by the aftermarket companies. The few companies that have stepped up have been hit and miss, we asked for something and they gave us what they thought we wanted, not what we've been loudly asking for. When we provided input telling them what to change on their product(s), many ignored us again and then said that sales could be better. Therefore most Ascender peeps have learned to make do and build the parts ourselves. I really enjoy my Ascenders and keep crawling with them and letting anybody test drive them, because I believe in them. I can't wait to see what we can do with VP VVDs, axles, pinion input shafts, etcetera! Thanks and looking forward to some great new products!

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by Harley

We did not move any rear link positions. Its a balance of keeping everything working with stock trucks and improving what we can. I'd love to be able to move stuff all around and fix everything possible, but we get reamed by most consumers for doing that and requiring extra parts to make it work.

I have a few other parts ready to go, but we also have to see how the Vaterra stuff will sell. If the market isn't popular for us, then how much effort do I put on it vs other new markets like the Losi rigs? We are a small shop, we only have so much capacity. I hope the Vaterra market is big and is just under visualized online.

What, if anything, about the axles is improved over stock? Is the gear ratio different? What about the steering geometry?

[Ascender'nMN84]

X2! Very well said. Don't forget guys like Ernie who took matters into his own hands. I have only been dealing with/talking to him for a couple months now whereas guys like you and Jato and a couple others appear to have been dealing with him for some time now. And you too Nate. Your knowledge of the hobby that you share is awesome. Thank you. Now that VP has thrown their hat in the ring, I would imagine you'll start seeing other manufacturers jump in the Ascender market too. I doubt I'll make the jump to their axles right away but I've already got one set of VVD's in the project truck and probably going to order another set or 2 for my original + backups. And if they're doing axles, I'd imagine knuckles and c hubs are on their way in the future along with links. Part of me wants to say "screw them we haven't needed their stuff in the past. Why now?" But with that attitude, sales wouldn't justify cost, they bail on production, leaving us exactly where we were 6 months ago. Ok diatribe over.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[Natedog]

Improvements are always good, hope to see better products, not just replicated stock parts (which are quite good, but everything can be improved upon.

Thanks, yes Ernie has been a huge help too. I understand where you're coming from and am looking forward to some improved parts. I have a set of VVDs on order!

[Harley]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

What, if anything, about the axles is improved over stock? Is the gear ratio different? What about the steering geometry?

We have decided to go forward with our milled in C-hubs which not everyone will enjoy but for Scale looks, I don't think it can be beat. Now withakjng that decision we had to adjust the built in caster from the "stock" location. We rolled it back to give better steering geometry/better pinion angle. While doing that we also would have had panhard interference so we adjusted the position/height of that which will also more closely match the angle of the drag link when mounted directly to the knuckle rather than to the tie-rod.

The Vaterra makes it easy to adjust camber in stock form with its smooth housings but it's decision we made for Scale looks plus the added value of including the C-hubs into the price of the housing. For those of you who aren't familiar, our milled in C-hubs have a replaceable chromoly threaded insert for the knuckle screws. So you will not strip those out, but if you did, they pop right out and a new one can be replaced.

We are also using our 1-piece bearing retainer design which better supports the ring gear bearings without adding a crushing force to it. The stock Vaterra diff cover is never something I liked and was even surprised that axial took the same design into the SCX10-2.

So these axles, which should be about the same cost as our scx10-2 Curries ($129 front/$119 rear) will give you:
Housings
C-hubs/lockouts
Diff cover
Upper link mounts

If you subtract the cost of those things from the housing, you end up with a pretty affordable upgrade.

[Harley]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

What, if anything, about the axles is improved over stock? Is the gear ratio different? What about the steering geometry?

Also, no the gear ratio isn't affected as we aren't making/providing gears. The Vaterra gear ratio is something that was always a bummer to me, as with just that one simple change in initial design could have greatly changed the trucks initial popularity I feel.

[Natedog]

I like your milled in c-hubs with the replaceable threaded inserts, great solution to several problems and as you said, they do look much more scale. Sounds good on adding a little more caster and taking into account the pinion angle and panhard mount!

[Natedog]

A set of under drive axle gears that fit in stock and VP axle housings would be awesome!

[Natedog]

I don't expect to break these new VVDs anytime soon, but I like to be prepared for when things wear out or I drop a pin and it rolls across garage floor into the abyss. Does the SCX VVD rebuild kit fit the Ascender VVDs?

[Harley]

Originally Posted by Natedog

I don't expect to break these new VVDs anytime soon, but I like to be prepared for when things wear out or I drop a pin and it rolls across garage floor into the abyss. Does the SCX VVD rebuild kit fit the Ascender VVDs?

It's a different size pin, we'll get a rebuild kit on the site soon. For now, shoot us an email through vpsupport@vanquishproducts.com and one of our guys can send you a pin!

[rockhugger]

Originally Posted by Harley

We have decided to go forward with our milled in C-hubs which not everyone will enjoy but for Scale looks, I don't think it can be beat. Now withakjng that decision we had to adjust the built in caster from the "stock" location. We rolled it back to give better steering geometry/better pinion angle. While doing that we also would have had panhard interference so we adjusted the position/height of that which will also more closely match the angle of the drag link when mounted directly to the knuckle rather than to the tie-rod.


The Vaterra makes it easy to adjust camber in stock form with its smooth housings but it's decision we made for Scale looks plus the added value of including the C-hubs into the price of the housing. For those of you who aren't familiar, our milled in C-hubs have a replaceable chromoly threaded insert for the knuckle screws. So you will not strip those out, but if you did, they pop right out and a new one can be replaced.

We are also using our 1-piece bearing retainer design which better supports the ring gear bearings without adding a crushing force to it. The stock Vaterra diff cover is never something I liked and was even surprised that axial took the same design into the SCX10-2.

So these axles, which should be about the same cost as our scx10-2 Curries ($129 front/$119 rear) will give you:
Housings
C-hubs/lockouts
Diff cover
Upper link mounts

If you subtract the cost of those things from the housing, you end up with a pretty affordable upgrade.

I'm very pleased to hear this design decision and update, these are all things I was hoping you would do, especially after seeing the current 10.2 design.
The price sounds great too. I'm looking forward to setting up both my ascenders and many future builds I do. Gotta support our local Sacramento company.

Originally Posted by Natedog

I don't expect to break these new VVDs anytime soon, but I like to be prepared for when things wear out or I drop a pin and it rolls across garage floor into the abyss. Does the SCX VVD rebuild kit fit the Ascender VVDs?

I thought you trained one of your kitahs to be small parts sniffer and retriever.

[Natedog]

Originally Posted by Harley

It's a different size pin, we'll get a rebuild kit on the site soon. For now, shoot us an email through vpsupport@vanquishproducts.com and one of our guys can send you a pin!

Thanks, email sent!

Originally Posted by rockhugger

I'm very pleased to hear this design decision and update, these are all things I was hoping you would do, especially after seeing the current 10.2 design.
The price sounds great too. I'm looking forward to setting up both my ascenders and many future builds I do. Gotta support our local Sacramento company.

I thought you trained one of your kitahs to be small parts sniffer and retriever.

X2

Kitah is a great parts sniffer and retriever, but she likes to play with everything!

[bash-crash]

I think it is fantastic that these axles are coming out. Been too long of a wait though haha. I know there is a set of these on my want list and will be grabbing them as soon as they are available. I do hope the ascender market is there for you guys and it is feasible to keep producing and releasing new products for this truck. The axles are looking great so far and I am excited to to get them into my hands!

[Natedog]

X2, LHS says about two weeks on the axle housings.

LHS had a couple sets of VP VVDs for Ascender and they sold out in a snap, they hope to have more soon as peeps are asking for them and couple guys there have Ascenders.

[rockhugger]

Originally Posted by Harley

We did not move any rear link positions. Its a balance of keeping everything working with stock trucks and improving what we can. I'd love to be able to move stuff all around and fix everything possible, but we get reamed by most consumers for doing that and requiring extra parts to make it work.

I have a few other parts ready to go, but we also have to see how the Vaterra stuff will sell. If the market isn't popular for us, then how much effort do I put on it vs other new markets like the Losi rigs? We are a small shop, we only have so much capacity. I hope the Vaterra market is big and is just under visualized online.

I realize you can't make drastic changes that affect compatability, but
Would any additional vertical link seperation at the aXle be possible without any additional repercussions such as parts or other modifications? Even a minor adjustment upwards could help mitigate torque twist, especially when combined with frame mounted link risers. If not, possibly that could be an add on piece later to allow upper link adjustability at the punkin.

[luckster]

Hey Josh, Lucky here from KCRC. Great to see you guys got involed with the Ascender. I ordered one yesterday. I have been a big fan of Vanquish for a long time. Jeepiac AKA Jon Nichols here in Kc. let my drive his little stubby Bronco Ascender. I had to have one. I love tha axles on the SCX10 ii great upgrade rantastic design and a real eyecatcher. I figure I'll have to have a set for this tiny truck too. Keep up the good work man.

[Harley]

Originally Posted by rockhugger

I realize you can't make drastic changes that affect compatability, but
Would any additional vertical link seperation at the aXle be possible without any additional repercussions such as parts or other modifications? Even a minor adjustment upwards could help mitigate torque twist, especially when combined with frame mounted link risers. If not, possibly that could be an add on piece later to allow upper link adjustability at the punkin.

The upper link mounting locations are built into the housing so making them adjustable or optional is not a possibility. I do understand the desire for a change on that part, however we have a few restrictions that were working around as far as machining goes. Making everyone happy is never possible, but hopefully these satisfy the market.

Tonight we finished prototyping the rear axle and I mounted it to the C10. Everything is ready to go at this point and we will be in production next week.