Coronavirus - Covid-19

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by $uicide $hift

Two problems in this is the people that abuse the system and the government that puts in policies that make it very difficult for people to get off the system.

Thats the real problem, one side doesnt want you off the system because then you start to think for yourself.

Originally Posted by Topher Builds

One day we’ll all wake up and there won’t be a new post in this thread.

That day will be a good day.

I predict November itll turn into either 'hes still not my president' or 'what the hell is this new guy mumbling about'

[themountain]

Originally Posted by $uicide $hift

He did HIRE the person. They were an employee of his on the companies payroll earning the wage that anybody else would earn in that position.

??? Where was then the problem with the raise he gave him ??He hired the man only because of the tax deduction he could get which come with certain limitations? Something doesent add up here , my friend .

[$uicide $hift]

Originally Posted by themountain

??? Where was then the problem with the raise he gave him ??He hired the man only because of the tax deduction he could get which come with certain limitations? Something doesent add up here , my friend .

I don't speak of how things work in your country as I do not have a clue. Please take the same stance here.

If you read what I wrote I have stated the issue / problem. If you cannot comprehend that statement I cannot explain it for you any differently so that you are able to understand.

FYI: He did not hire him just because he got a tax deduction. He needed help and at the same time it helped him with taxes. Instead of putting in an AD and interviewing he was sent people that really needed the work. This however has NOTHING to do with how our government works and how the policy they set actually hurt the person trying to better themselves.

[themountain]

Originally Posted by $uicide $hift

He did not hire him just because he got a tax deduction. He needed help and at the same time it helped him with taxes. .

ahh ja, I thought so...goodness of heard and so on

My doubt is why that poor man was still on welfare even when he had a "contract" job with your dad ?? Is that usual in the US ??

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by $uicide $hift

OMG I want to have babies with you!

Thanks...I think?

Originally Posted by iplaywithrocks

Jato you should vote locally at least .

Presidential elections maybe I can see skipping

I gotta believe not everyone on welfare is a bad person . The govt can enable a p.o.s but I don’t think they create them. I think they are just kinda born..
if only there was a super flu that would wipe them out .

Maybe I should vote in the local elections, but with housing developers in the pocket of the local officials I'm not sure it would do any good anyway.

I 100% do NOT believe everybody on welfare is bad! I never said that and I hope I didn't insinuate it. If a person is physically unable to work due to a physical disability or if they need TEMPORARY assistance due to hardship I am all for it. Welfare was started as a program to offer temporary relief to people that have fallen on hard times. That's not the problem. People abuse the system and it's turned into something people live off of. And that's the part that I have a huge problem with. Losers are going to be losers, but we shouldn't enable them with handouts.

You have to remember, I've been on both sides. I was physically disabled and unable to work and I did receive government assistance. Hell, the million dollars that it cost for my heart transplant was covered by tax payers. I am very thankful for that. I got the heart transplant so I could work and be a productive member of society. If I had remained on public assistance I would have been one of the losers that I hate. Instead, I enrolled in college months after my transplant, got a job after I graduated and I've been working and contributing my share ever since.

Originally Posted by Topher Builds

One day we’ll all wake up and there won’t be a new post in this thread.

That day will be a good day.

Threads like this can be good. They keep you thinking and you get to see the other side of things and see how other people think. But like any discussion on religion or politics, it can get heated or nasty.

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by $uicide $hift

These people have proven to be irresponsible so instead of saying birth control people to go sterilization. Now I am not on board with sterilization as that takes away somebodies rights. I am for however kicking them off welfare due to their poor decisions to have kids they cannot afford.

I really can't be bothered to reply to the foolish individual who thinks that not agreeing that people should be allowed to sponge off of society without any limit is related to eugenics in some way. We all know that comparing the person you are arguing with to Hitler is simply showing the weakness of your argument.

That person should be aware that his side of the political spectrum is the side that praised Hitler in any case. Nazism is simply a German contraction which means national socialism and Fascism, their ideology, is a leftist construct. He should also be aware that the founder of Planned Parenthood, Margaret Sanger, was very much in favor of eugenics to stop the production of "human weeds". Which political party holds Planned Parenthood in high esteem again?

I did not imply that people should simply be forcibly sterilised. I did say that they should be given a choice between being voluntarily sterilized or being involuntarily removed from the welfare rolls, and we all know which side of the political spectrum is all about the "right to choose", don't we?

I have to agree with James Madison who said, "I cannot undertake to lay my finger on that article of the Constitution which granted a right to Congress of expending, on objects of benevolence, the money of their constituents." That applies just as much today as it did when he said it.

Of course, people who disagree are perfectly free to spend their own money to help whomever they so choose. When they use the government to try to force me to do so it is no different to theft and is an affront to natural law. Read "The Law" by Frederic Bastiat for some guidance.

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by themountain

ahh ja, I thought so...goodness of heard and so on



My doubt is why that poor man was still on welfare even when he had a "contract" job with your dad ?? Is that usual in the US ??

You have obviously never had your own business. I have and, at times, have had certain parts of the work that can be done by unskilled workers but not enough to hire somebody full time. I offered this work to people who were prepared to do it at a reasonable rate, considering the unskilled nature of the tasks.

I have also seen that some of the people doing that work did it just well enough while others took some pride in the way that they did it and their efforts improved the products compared to the efforts of others. This meant that I could pay those who put in a little extra effort a bit more money. This might be anathema to progressives, who put equality of outcome on a high pedestal, but makes perfect sense to anybody capable of cogent thought.

The way that those in charge of welfare treated the person in question shows that they also didn't believe in one of the most basic tenets of the USA, that righteous effort deserves reward.

It might be hard for you to understand but that says more about you than it does about my comment.

[bbrigg]

The best "new normal".

[NoobCrawler]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

Threads like this can be good. They keep you thinking and you get to see the other side of things and see how other people think. But like any discussion on religion or politics, it can get heated or nasty.

Since being in an RC slump for some time, threads like this are what keep me coming back. I love these threads, for the reason you said, seeing the other side(and sometimes sides) of things. It sucks some of the more vocal members aren’t around anymore, or don’t get involved. I always enjoyed their crews even if I didn’t agree.

Also, it’s always interesting to see outsiders views. It has me curious just where are they getting their info & in what way is it presented...

[themountain]

Originally Posted by bbrigg

Read "The Law" by Frederic Bastiat for some guidance.

Thats a book from 1849...way before industrial revolution which changed all ground rules ;)

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by themountain

Thats a book from 1849...way before industrial revolution which changed all ground rules ;)

Yes it is. Some things transcend the changing times like this book and the US constitution where the values within are still valid and pertinent, while others, like "The Communist Manifesto", were deeply and intrinsically flawed at the time of their writing.

[themountain]

Originally Posted by bbrigg

Yes it is. Some things transcend the changing times like this book and the US constitution where the values within are still valid and pertinent, while others, like "The Communist Manifesto", were deeply and intrinsically flawed at the time of their writing.

That is debatable...anyway one has absolutely nothing to do with the other .
Fact is that soon after this book ,the classical economics (which as a true Liberal Bastiat was fond of) were abandoned for the "neoclassical" which dominates todays economics to this very day.
Everything has to be seen in a time context, right?

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by themountain

That is debatable...anyway one has absolutely nothing to do with the other .
Fact is that soon after this book ,the classical economics (which as a true Liberal Bastiat was fond of) were abandoned for the "neoclassical" which dominates todays economics to this very day.
Everything has to be seen in a time context, right?

Not right at all. If you believe that then you hold nothing to be intrinsically true. Everything depends on its time in that case which is obviously false. Do you know that a "classical liberal" was what you would call a far-right conservative today? Bastiat held to principles which would see him reviled by modern "liberals".

Modern liberals would be more accurately called ignorant leftists. I say ignorant because most of those who are self-described as "liberal" these days are utterly ignorant of the actual meaning of the word they denigrate by their use of it. Early leftists, despite their other obvious shortcomings, had a better grasp of history than the modern version.

Don't even get me started on my absolute disdain for today's leftists who, ignoring history and valid examples of pathetic failures in their own lifetime, still push for socialism yet have the utter temerity to style themselves as "progressives".

[themountain]

Originally Posted by bbrigg

Not right at all.
Everything depends on its time in that case which is obviously false.
Do you know that a "classical liberal" was what you would call a far-right conservative today?
Modern liberals would be more accurately called ignorant leftists.
I say ignorant because ... utterly ignorant of the actual meaning of the word they denigrate by their use of it.
Early leftists had a better grasp of history than the modern version as well.
Don't even get me started on my absolute disdain for today's leftists ....pathetic failures in their own lifetime, still push for socialism yet have the utter temerity to style themselves as "progressives".

Wow...you have it all figured out , right ?
We should all worship the great BB from Indonesia

I thought we discuss historic events and theories instead of calling names to people with certain political believes ....but thats ok...I didnt exspect anything less from you.

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by themountain

Wow...you have it all figured out , right ?

We should all worship the great BB from Indonesia



I thought we discuss historic events and theories instead of calling names to people with certain political believes ....but thats ok...I didnt exspect anything less from you.

I don't hold myself out as somebody who knows everything but I do have the ability to think clearly, am well read, and I'm also a pretty good researcher.

I have a definite tendency to call idiots "idiots". I don't see any downside to calling out the stupidity of those whose goal in life is to establish a system of government which has failed, miserably, every time it has been tried and it has, in the process of failing to achieve any of its stated goals, killed over one hundred million people.

If you have a problem with that, tough! You sound like either a juvenile with little life experience to call on, or, you could equally be the product of a modern university education and so enamored of the puffed up ignoramuses you see as your peers that you have no time for entertaining the idea that what you regard as your thinking is so shallow as to be unworthy of that word.

Since you see fit to argue please do so in a manner more worthy. Please regale us all with your enlightening tales of socialist utopias. Tell us every socialist idea that has ever stood up to reality and achieved its lofty goals in any measurable way. List, for our unworthy edification, every program by a leftist government, not just pure socialist, just plain vanilla leftist, that has achieved the goals it was promoted as doing in a cost-effective way with no collateral damage.

Then go away. Don't go away mad. Just go away.

[themountain]

Originally Posted by bbrigg

I don't hold myself out as somebody who knows everything but I do have the ability to think clearly, am well read, and I'm also a pretty good researcher.
.

reading things and understand them in the way they are suppose to be understood are different tasks , right? Why should I "enlighten" you with things you cant or will not understand ?? I dont want to convince anybody about my believes...is that so hard to grasp?

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by themountain

reading things and understand them in the way they are suppose to understand are different tasks , right?

I believe I qualified my statement sufficiently. I like understanding things the way they actually work, not just the way that some theoretician hoped I would see them.

[themountain]

Originally Posted by bbrigg

I don't hold myself out as somebody who knows everything but
I do have the ability to think clearly,
I am well read, and
I'm also a pretty good researcher.
I have a definite tendency to call idiots "idiots".
I don't see any downside to calling out the stupidity of those whose ..

You sound like either a juvenile.. with little life experience ... the product of a modern university.... what you regard as your thinking is so shallow
... not just pure socialist, just plain vanilla leftist,

I had to read that again

Sounds very humble to me ...and a bit like DT

[themountain]

Originally Posted by bbrigg

I believe I qualified my statement sufficiently. I like understanding things the way they actually work, not just the way that some theoretician hoped I would see them.

No ....You like things who fit your purpose ...thats different

[bbrigg]

Originally Posted by themountain

No ....You like things who fit your purpose ...thats different

Really? This coming from a pseudo-intellectual like you? You have been wrong on everything else so far, and you are wrong on this as well.

Now go away. You are just a juvenile halfwit with delusions of adequacy.