Joywrex's Creeper Build (First RC ever)

[joywrex]

I noticed that the rear axle has a lot of play left to right. I think it has to do with my rear shock placement being so wide. It can move maybe 1/2" to an 1" from side to side. Is this normal? Good? Bad? The front axle doesn't have play like the rear.

[granborismo]

Originally Posted by joywrex

I noticed that the rear axle has a lot of play left to right. I think it has to do with my rear shock placement being so wide. It can move maybe 1/2" to an 1" from side to side. Is this normal? Good? Bad? The front axle doesn't have play like the rear.

moving shocks wont do much. it is most likely because your upper links are too parrallel to one another.
can you get away without having those spacers on the chassis side of your links?. if not then put some spacers in between the back to triangulate the uppers like this _\ /_ a bit more. should reduce it somewhat.

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by joywrex

I noticed that the rear axle has a lot of play left to right. I think it has to do with my rear shock placement being so wide. It can move maybe 1/2" to an 1" from side to side. Is this normal? Good? Bad? The front axle doesn't have play like the rear.

Yeah your rear uppers are too parallel...they need 2* plus inward at the axle to each other...this is why almost everyone running a Creeper Link has bent uppers in the rear...a small spacer at the chassis and a 1/4" spacer at the Creeper Link will most likely resolve the issuse...let me know.

Thomas

[JokersWild]

Originally Posted by joywrex

I noticed that the rear axle has a lot of play left to right. I think it has to do with my rear shock placement being so wide. It can move maybe 1/2" to an 1" from side to side. Is this normal? Good? Bad? The front axle doesn't have play like the rear.

Like stated above you need to double apposed triangulate the links (upper to lower). Also its bad to have that much throw in the axle movement (will wear out joints pre maturely and put greater stress on joints). Should be stable and solid. On other rigs the lowers are in a lot more at the frame side to give the lowers more triangulation and becomes more stable this way. The creepers transmission is mounted into the "belly pan" making this not able to happen. So moving to a more triangulated upper is the way to stabilize it.

And so on to the reason I read 8 pages..... and didnt see it posted once: More pics of said chick with no wedding ring. After page one I was let down tremendously with lack of these photos. The build was going "good" almost "too good"

[joywrex]

I installed the driveline update parts. I had to cut down the inner shaft a little bit. The pin covers on the larger shafts don't fit over the pins all the way... It's over 1/2 of the pins though so that should be enough.

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by JokersWild

Like stated above you need to double apposed triangulate the links (upper to lower). Also its bad to have that much throw in the axle movement (will wear out joints pre maturely and put greater stress on joints). Should be stable and solid. On other rigs the lowers are in a lot more at the frame side to give the lowers more triangulation and becomes more stable this way. The creepers transmission is mounted into the "belly pan" making this not able to happen. So moving to a more triangulated upper is the way to stabilize it.

The Creeper trans/skid mount and link geometry is actually very sound as far as the lowers go...at the tranny belly where the lowers attach, the lowers are less than half the width apart there, that they are at the axle...plenty of angle. The stock uppers are mounted way too close together and cause horrendous amounts of torque twist until the uppers are raised and seperated at the axle...thats what I designed the Creeper Link to take care of. I go for about 2-3* of closing angle from the chassis to the axle on the rear and somewhere around 5-10* on the front although my New BTL steering plate sets the upper closer to a 3-5* angle closing at the axle form the chassis. The Creeper Link rear axle plate is right at 3" wide at the tabs which is real close to stock chassis width...I recommend a 1-2mm spacer at the chassis and a 6-10mm spacer at the Creeper Link for the uppers....2-3*+ closing angle is more than enough to stop axle steer as long as the lowers are close to stock location/s.

[joywrex]

Originally Posted by JokersWild

Like stated above you need to double apposed triangulate the links (upper to lower). Also its bad to have that much throw in the axle movement (will wear out joints pre maturely and put greater stress on joints). Should be stable and solid. On other rigs the lowers are in a lot more at the frame side to give the lowers more triangulation and becomes more stable this way. The creepers transmission is mounted into the "belly pan" making this not able to happen. So moving to a more triangulated upper is the way to stabilize it.

And so on to the reason I read 8 pages..... and didnt see it posted once: More pics of said chick with no wedding ring. After page one I was let down tremendously with lack of these photos. The build was going "good" almost "too good"

Haha that's my girlfriend. Sorry to disappoint.

I adjusted the links to be a little more triangulated:

[JokersWild]

Originally Posted by rmdesignworks

The Creeper trans/skid mount and link geometry is actually very sound as far as the lowers go...at the tranny belly where the lowers attach, the lowers are less than half the width apart there, that they are at the axle...plenty of angle. The stock uppers are mounted way too close together and cause horrendous amounts of torque twist until the uppers are raised and seperated at the axle...thats what I designed the Creeper Link to take care of. I go for about 2-3* of closing angle from the chassis to the axle on the rear and somewhere around 5-10* on the front although my New BTL steering plate sets the upper closer to a 3-5* angle closing at the axle form the chassis. The Creeper Link rear axle plate is right at 3" wide at the tabs which is real close to stock chassis width...I recommend a 1-2mm spacer at the chassis and a 6-10mm spacer at the Creeper Link for the uppers....2-3*+ closing angle is more than enough to stop axle steer as long as the lowers are close to stock location/s.

Not to debate the suspension geometry bit..... and fill this full or 1:1 debate vs RC scale squat vs anti squat, and so on but the instant center is not point full on this size of a rig..... and im sure that the many that have pushed their lowers about 1/2in apart and closer can attest to that theory while running uppers about a 1/4in apart on the axle sides to frame width. I know there is nothing to be done in the case the creeper due to where the transmission lies. And hell what works for one dont work for all..... some like it loosey goosey and some like it all bound up. And just like we say on the PBB..... ya cant go wrong with more triangulation

[jojo303d]

Originally Posted by JokersWild

Not to debate the suspension geometry bit..... and fill this full or 1:1 debate vs RC scale squat vs anti squat, and so on but the instant center is not point full on this size of a rig..... and im sure that the many that have pushed their lowers about 1/2in apart and closer can attest to that theory while running uppers about a 1/4in apart on the axle sides to frame width. I know there is nothing to be done in the case the creeper due to where the transmission lies. And hell what works for one dont work for all..... some like it loosey goosey and some like it all bound up. And just like we say on the PBB..... ya cant go wrong with more triangulation

More triangulation greater roll center less triangulation less roll center thuss less TT

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by joywrex

Haha that's my girlfriend. Sorry to disappoint.

I adjusted the links to be a little more triangulated:

That looks like a lot better...thats right about where mine is and several others' with the set up Ive suggested...and it works.

[jebster]

i haven't seen those drive shaft upgrades before. who makes those?

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by jojo303d

More triangulation greater roll center less triangulation less roll center thuss less TT

SOme amount of roll center is necessary to lock the chassis between the axles...but the further behind the rig you can get the roll center the better the TT effect is. And I dont debate 1:1 vs. scale at all because first of all my Creeper axles wont carry a 600 lb rc chassis...and if my calcs are correct the tires would have to be air tight and inflated to about 5.5psi for decent traction on rocks. The amount of torque generated by a 6 lb rc in relation to its weight requires more link geometry spread based on the power to weight ratio.

[jojo303d]

Originally Posted by rmdesignworks

SOme amount of roll center is necessary to lock the chassis between the axles...but the further behind the rig you can get the roll center the better the TT effect is. And I dont debate 1:1 vs. scale at all because first of all my Creeper axles wont carry a 600 lb rc chassis...and if my calcs are correct the tires would have to be air tight and inflated to about 5.5psi for decent traction on rocks. The amount of torque generated by a 6 lb rc in relation to its weight requires more link geometry spread based on the power to weight ratio.

Couldnt say it beter myself

[joywrex]

New Battery placement up front:

[joywrex]

Putting the Batt in the front made a ton of difference.

Then I tore a pin out of the driveshaft.

[rmdesignworks]

Did you break it on rocks at least?

[joywrex]

Originally Posted by rmdesignworks

Did you break it on rocks at least?

Yeah I did. They are downsizing their crawling area and so people had come and removed a lot of the rocks so it was especially treacherous...

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by joywrex

Yeah I did. They are downsizing their crawling area and so people had come and removed a lot of the rocks so it was especially treacherous...

That sucks bro...how was the rig doing before the break? How was the TT?

[joywrex]

The TT is much better now. Adding the spacers on the back helped a lot, I'll add some more when I get some.

It broke when I got stuck in a hole and gave it too much power. The pin covers on the shaft only fit over 1/2 of the pin so I think that the only place the pin to go was through the plastic. The pin cover could have been pressing against the pin...

Should I just get the Traxxas long truck shafts or try to find just the plastic parts of the venom shafts? I'm guessing the Traxxas shafts that people are using would last longer...

[rmdesignworks]

Originally Posted by joywrex

The TT is much better now. Adding the spacers on the back helped a lot, I'll add some more when I get some.

It broke when I got stuck in a hole and gave it too much power. The pin covers on the shaft only fit over 1/2 of the pin so I think that the only place the pin to go was through the plastic. The pin cover could have been pressing against the pin...

Should I just get the Traxxas long truck shafts or try to find just the plastic parts of the venom shafts? I'm guessing the Traxxas shafts that people are using would last longer...

Most of us are using Traxxas shafts...mine have lasted a crazy long time.