2015 scale rules discussion or question thead

[War Pig]

Originally Posted by holycaveman

Which brings up another question about cms in class 3 getting a -5. In 1:1 there is no such thing as cms in class 3 LOL. It should be like -2 for hiding a servo rather than -5 for something unrealistic like cms. But anyways.

I guess I don't understand your question here, why not CMS in Class 3?

[holycaveman]

Originally Posted by War Pig

I guess I don't understand your question here, why not CMS in Class 3?

Giving someone a -5 for something that doesn't exist in 1;1 seems odd. I understand wanting servos out of site. But the builder should have the option of hiding /camouflage it themselves.

Cms or frame mounted steering box does not exist on a class 3 rig in real life. Even my off road only xj is begging for full hydro with 36" tires. Soon as I go 38" tires I will have to have it. C3 is a class for purpose built rigs. In the real world none of them would have cms.

So basically it's awarding people a -5 for not being scale to the build. Just odd? Class one everyone should have cms

[War Pig]

I guess I don't limit Class 3 trucks to just giant, hardcore rigs. Sure 90% of them are but how about someone that wants to build a Deuce and a half with 2.2 tires or a 1/8th scale rig. Really, I'm all for rewarding someone for taking the servo off the axle no matter if it's scale to 1:1 or not. Tell you what, just to make you feel better we won't reward you for it

[holycaveman]

LOL

Well I would not run cms because my build wouldn't have it in real life. if it would, I would have it on my rig. My build does require a motor in the rear, so it has that.

No points awarded even though it's more scale And hidden.

I mean a -5 is a heck of a lot for something that isn't scale.

It's just odd. Not a big deal. I am used to not being rewarded for being scale. LOL

And I appreciate all the patience you guys have with answering the seemingly unrelentless Questions.

I hope that some of them get at least some consideration.

Thanks

[sellenk]

Originally Posted by holycaveman

LOL

Well I would not run cms because my build wouldn't have it in real life. if it would, I would have it on my rig. My build does require a motor in the rear, so it has that.

No points awarded even though it's more scale And hidden.

I mean a -5 is a heck of a lot for something that isn't scale.

It's just odd. Not a big deal. I am used to not being rewarded for being scale. LOL

And I appreciate all the patience you guys have with answering the seemingly unrelentless Questions.

I hope that some of them get at least some consideration.

Thanks

Yeah I always thought that the CMS in class 3 was kind of strange too since like you say it's encouraging people to build a truck that's not scale (in the case where the 1:1 you're building your RC off of has hydraulic steering) just to get more scale points. But if you look at it in terms of leveling the performance advantage gained by axle mounted steering vs chassis mounted it makes sense. Similar to why full leaf springs get -7 vs no points for a four link. Especially if the real truck has leafs or CMS it gives the builder some incentive to build it this way even though it may not perform as well instead of just going to four link and axle mount.

[holycaveman]

The thing is you can make cms just as effective as an axle mounted servo. I have both. And you know what. Both do their jobs and turn the wheels.

So in class three is honestly not scale"cms" and we give -points for it. Class 3 is a competitive class. And you build to be scale and to win. So a -5 for not being scale can make a difference between 1st and being off the podium. So when you mix scale points with course points that -5 for being not scale can ruin your day in a hurry.

[hotwheels000]

The reward for cms has more fawcets than just what you would see i a 1:1 rig. It is also rewarded due to the higner cog in creates. A lot of the rules and rewards are to try and keep an even playing feild between the rigs.

[holycaveman]

Originally Posted by hotwheels000

The reward for cms has more fawcets than just what you would see i a 1:1 rig. It is also rewarded due to the higner cog in creates. A lot of the rules and rewards are to try and keep an even playing feild between the rigs.

I realize this. And honestly giving people perks for a less capable rig only exists in the scale world. No other sport awards poor choices in a competitive class. To put it bluntly.

But the fact remains that you give a amature a pro built rig and the pro will take the amature rig and clean house. You can NEVER level a playing field. The best guy wins no matter what rules you try to implement.

And honestly why wouldn't you want the best driver and rig to win?

[1BadJeepBruiser]

The problem in general is grown men, in some cases, acting like children and wanting to win a stupid bowling trophy so badly that they have to continue to skirt rules in order to win with their comp truck... I mean scale truck...

I have been saying it for years but no one wants to listen to me because I don't compete enough... Take away the prizes and recognition for the driving or competing aspect and put it on the building aspects. If the clubs, or event holders didn't give out the kits, and big money prizes to someone who can drive good with their cheater scale rig and just left it with say a ribbon for first place through 3rd or 4th I can guarantee people will stop pushing the limit of the rules and get back to building the scalest trucks possible if kits and big prizes are given out for concours judging on the most realistic looking truck....after all, isn't that the point of scaler ? For it to be SCALE?? People are forgetting what this was about... It's become so main stream that all the skill has been taking out and only a few people actually build what I perceive to be a "scale" rig. I look around at some of the class 3 trucks, and I get it, it's class 3 but some of them barely resemble anything realistic. Granted, I already know someone will always find that one stupid rig on pirate and be like "oh yeah it exist, looks here's ONE"

Just my 2 cents... I know it'll never happen and I know my opinion means snit. Hence why I just build my trucks the way I want and play with them as I see fit... One last note though... Next time anyone is at a real scale scale comp, take a look at whats going on...on the side that is. You'll notice after the scale comp part is over groups of guys are out and about doing trail rides with actual scalers... If you are actually into scale youll understand where I am going with that.

[War Pig]

Originally Posted by 1BadJeepBruiser

The problem in general is grown men, in some cases, acting like children and wanting to win a stupid bowling trophy so badly that they have to continue to skirt rules in order to win with their comp truck... I mean scale truck...

I have been saying it for years but no one wants to listen to me because I don't compete enough... Take away the prizes and recognition for the driving or competing aspect and put it on the building aspects. If the clubs, or event holders didn't give out the kits, and big money prizes to someone who can drive good with their cheater scale rig and just left it with say a ribbon for first place through 3rd or 4th I can guarantee people will stop pushing the limit of the rules and get back to building the scalest trucks possible if kits and big prizes are given out for concours judging on the most realistic looking truck....after all, isn't that the point of scaler ? For it to be SCALE?? People are forgetting what this was about... It's become so main stream that all the skill has been taking out and only a few people actually build what I perceive to be a "scale" rig. I look around at some of the class 3 trucks, and I get it, it's class 3 but some of them barely resemble anything realistic. Granted, I already know someone will always find that one stupid rig on pirate and be like "oh yeah it exist, looks here's ONE"

Just my 2 cents... I know it'll never happen and I know my opinion means snit. Hence why I just build my trucks the way I want and play with them as I see fit... One last note though... Next time anyone is at a real scale scale comp, take a look at whats going on...on the side that is. You'll notice after the scale comp part is over groups of guys are out and about doing trail rides with actual scalers... If you are actually into scale youll understand where I am going with that.

^^ That's so money ^^

[doublej]

Originally Posted by 1BadJeepBruiser

Just my 2 cents...

I think your completely off good Sir......

You 1:1 right? So you want the best parts, pieces and design so that your 1:1 works the best it can, right? So why can't I do that with my scale truck?

I think the sheer will to make things better and preform at their best will always give you a group of people pushing the limits of their trucks. This leads to building some crazy stuff - Same as we have seen over the years in 1:1.

Is every idea perfectly scale? Maybe, maybe not - But if you ask 10 people to define scale, your gonna get 8 different answers.


Funny thing is - There is more guys using the words "thats not scale" then guys walking up to a scale comp saying "Im going to win". I think some people get so caught up on YOUR definition of what should and shouldn't be, that they forget to look and see whos smiling and enjoying their scale toys.

Just my 2 cents, but my opinion doesn't hold much..... I just build what makes me smile and have fun. If it fits, it fits; if it don't, it don't....... I'm still smiling and enjoying my hobby.

[RcBro]

Originally Posted by RcBro

The rule as I read it from this thread 2015 Scale Rules states:

"No comp style knuckle weights of any kind"

Does this mean the builder can paint and modify the knuckle weight to be camoflauged or appear to be a caliper and rotor? We can very easily make a set of these to bolt on to the exterior of our weights.



Some silver and red paint and you have a scale looking part.

On a serious note, can someone help enlighten me on this rule. I thought originally there was some fine print mentioning it cannot bolt to the knuckle.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[holycaveman]

This is the only thing I found?

• No comp style knuckle weights of any kind

[doublej]

Originally Posted by RcBro

On a serious note, can someone help enlighten me on this rule. I thought originally there was some fine print mentioning it cannot bolt to the knuckle.

• No comp style knuckle weights of any kind

That is all the rule says - I don't think you would see that rotor and caliper setup on a Shafty or MOA, so how you mount it is not in question per the rules.
Looking like a rotor and caliper setup vs a big hunk of flat brass - Legal and game on.


Can you mod me a set too while your at it?

[holycaveman]

So it looks to me like those would be fine? They are scale style knuckle weights, not comp style.

[johnnyh66]

I like my rigs to look as scale as I can make them... but, they are rc and on a "scale" level... I want to build them to be waaaaaay more capable then what I can build/afford in 1:1.
I'd never be able to build a 2000hp monster that can roll 50' down a cliff bouncing off trees and rocks, land on all 4's and drive through the next gate... but I can in rc.

[holycaveman]

I agreed with a lot of Bads post. But not all of it. "scale encompasses much more than a hard body with a cms set up. Although for some reason all the scale points reward this type of build? So you can go in and build a totally out of proportion hard body truck with 57" tires and Clean house on scale points.

I go in building an actual scale rock buggy and am lucky to hit 30 points. and if I stick to being actually scale I will never hit 50. Impossible.

So take rocky mountain Nats. 5 courses at 50% scale points. That's an auto +50 points for me to compete! And that is for being scale (thank you very little!)

So o am punished in competition for being scale. My rig is a scale rock buggy with only about 2" under the belly. It's not like I run a moa.

This is the front axle I have hours in. Hidden servo and all. No points for it. But i just love building things to scale Even though its not worth anything to the current sorrca rules. I don't have jaw dropping fab work. But i try to be scale and true to the build.

[holycaveman]

What's funny is I can build a hard bodied 60 point truck that is pretty much a comp truck and clean house. Totally not scale. But there is more to scale comps than taking advantage of slightly out of touch scale points system. It's building scale that is fun to you and doing your best with it.

[1BadJeepBruiser]

Originally Posted by doublej

I think your completely off good Sir......

You 1:1 right? So you want the best parts, pieces and design so that your 1:1 works the best it can, right? So why can't I do that with my scale truck?

I think the sheer will to make things better and preform at their best will always give you a group of people pushing the limits of their trucks. This leads to building some crazy stuff - Same as we have seen over the years in 1:1.

Is every idea perfectly scale? Maybe, maybe not - But if you ask 10 people to define scale, your gonna get 8 different answers.


Funny thing is - There is more guys using the words "thats not scale" then guys walking up to a scale comp saying "Im going to win". I think some people get so caught up on YOUR definition of what should and shouldn't be, that they forget to look and see whos smiling and enjoying their scale toys.

Just my 2 cents, but my opinion doesn't hold much..... I just build what makes me smile and have fun. If it fits, it fits; if it don't, it don't....... I'm still smiling and enjoying my hobby.

You have obviously seen my 1:1... Therefore my point still stands. My 83 hilux is a daily driver/weekend warrior.

Debating this with certain people in here is like arguing with a wall... It's going no where.

You guys keep driving your Rigs for your bowling trophys with stick on wheel weights on axles...

[doublej]

Originally Posted by 1BadJeepBruiser

You guys keep driving your Rigs for your bowling trophys with stick on wheel weights on axles...

When have you seen wheel weights on any of my axles?
But that is my point - to you, your way is the only way. I don't believe there is a "right" answer when you try to define the word scale.
Your opinion is just that, an opinion. And I would never disregard or not want to go playing with toys with someome because their opinion differs.

And for the record, I stopped caring about trophies when I stopped 1:1 comping.
I build what I want because I enjoy it, just like I dodge cones because I enjoy it.