3d printer for rc parts

[Rekreant]

I still use my CR-10 every day and love it. The only upgrade I would recommend is the same I would recommend for anyone, and thats an E3D V6 hotend.

[Ditchrat]

Originally Posted by Rekreant

I still use my CR-10 every day and love it. The only upgrade I would recommend is the same I would recommend for anyone, and thats an E3D V6 hotend.

Why is that? I have very little issues with the stock hotend, you know if it isnt broke don't fix it. But that also puts me in a trap of not realizing that I should be looking for something better.

[JohnRobHolmes]

A different hot end is useful if you are using PETG, nylon, or TPU and want to push it fast. If you are only printing PLA, or can deal with slow printing on hotter melt materials, the stock hot end is absolutely fine. The majority of upgrades that people do to these machines do nothing for print quality. It's more of a hobby of upgrading the machine, and then once it is all "upgraded" they lose interest and have nothing else to print. Quite a few of my friends have printers that do nothing after they printed all the "upgrades", because they bought it with no need for it.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

A different hot end is useful if you are using PETG, nylon, or TPU and want to push it fast. If you are only printing PLA, or can deal with slow printing on hotter melt materials, the stock hot end is absolutely fine. The majority of upgrades that people do to these machines do nothing for print quality. It's more of a hobby of upgrading the machine, and then once it is all "upgraded" they lose interest and have nothing else to print. Quite a few of my friends have printers that do nothing after they printed all the "upgrades", because they bought it with no need for it.

Upgraded my main printer, built a seperate dedicated room in my basement, printed all the hop up parts and some fun stuff. Did everything for print quality and productivity. Biggest use Ive gotten since was prototyping a slew of parts for new sportsman rig. I get side work that comes in from others looking for parts or prototyping but other then that I havent had a big push to dig in again.

Room sits dark but its good knowing when I do turn the lights on the last thing I worry about is how long will it take lol.

[JohnRobHolmes]

I upgraded both my main printer hot ends, there is certainly reasons for it. All metal hot ends make a big difference when pushing for regular production consistency. The number of users that run machines for production is a small percentage, and my point is that the average person will be spending money upgrading and never recover the extra expense. It is nothing more than spending money on a hobby endeavor, and that is OK too, as long as the person understands the reasoning and goals behind spending more money. I just see so many people frustrated after dropping $500 upgrading a $500 printer without any tangible quality changes. In many cases the upgrades cause more problems because the user didn't learn how to tune the printer properly in the first place. So they spend money and still get crappy results, then spend more money thinking that more "upgrades" are needed. I think most people here are sharp enough to understand this, but it needs to be discussed so that new users don't get caught in the same trap of upgrading.



My decisions to change parts are based on the payback period of running production. This is beaten into my head so hard from the difficulties of manufacturing motors. A tool that speeds production is only worth making when it doesn't cost more than the production time saved. 4 days (96hrs) of production with a new hot end paid for the hot end due to faster product output (not including my time to install and retune). 15 more days (360 print hours) of production with the new hot end pays off the printer in marginal product output increase. I can get behind this reasoning for upgrades. I can get behind the reasoning of wanting faster prototyping or household trinkets, no paypack period. I can get behind upgrading simply for the hobby too, no payback period. As long as the user isn't upgrading before the learning curve is met. That is the big problem that should be avoided.

[JatoTheRipper]

There are more than a handful of companies that use FDM printers for production, but most of them suck at it. Only a few do it well. When I see the garbage that most of the scale accessories "manufacturers", including some of the big names, sell I shake my head.

But this is a hobby and most of us aren't using our printers for production. Upgrades don't make financial sense, but if it works better for us than we get benefit from the money. It's not like putting $150 aluminum wheels on our scalers add performance, but we do it because we want to.

[JohnRobHolmes]

While I'm ranting, stay away from "smoother boards". It's a part that is just as likely to cause problems of missed steps as it is to smooth. Smoothing via diode drop is such a narrow window of possibility. The exact same result can be met with changing driver voltage or speed rate to get away from the 50% duty cycle harmonics at some given print speed. The boards simply drop some voltage in the form of HEAT so that some print speed is (maybe) further from the 50% duty cycle harmonic.

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...B&gclsrc=aw.ds


A straightforward solution to avoid surface issues due to harmonics is to simply turn the part so that there is not a straight edge along the axis that gives issue at some print speed. This is assuming that belt harmonics are not the cause, in which case the surface patterning will be the same distance apart as the belt tooth pitch. I have one printer that does not print smoothly at 35mms (and 70mms) along the X axis, it makes the surface ripply due to vibrations of the stepper at that exact speed. So, I turn the parts a little or simply go 10% above or below that speed. Along the same token, a 45 degree line at 50mms can have the same issue because it interpolates 35mms on both axis to create the 50mms diagonal speed.


Maybe one day we will have printers with closed loop control so that harmonics and lost steps are not an issue.

[JohnRobHolmes]

Originally Posted by JatoTheRipper

There are more than a handful of companies that use FDM printers for production, but most of them suck at it. Only a few do it well. When I see the garbage that most of the scale accessories "manufacturers", including some of the big names, sell I shake my head.

But this is a hobby and most of us aren't using our printers for production. Upgrades don't make financial sense, but if it works better for us than we get benefit from the money. It's not like putting $150 aluminum wheels on our scalers add performance, but we do it because we want to.

Absolutely on all accounts. The big issue that I see is people spending money on upgrades that aren't actually addressing the root issue of bad tuning. That is what I'm wagging a finger about. Put those fancy wheels on, by all means. Just don't get discouraged or mad when it doesn't crawl better since the foam tuning hasn't been done.

[JatoTheRipper]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

Absolutely on all accounts. The big issue that I see is people spending money on upgrades that aren't actually addressing the root issue of bad tuning. That is what I'm wagging a finger about. Put those fancy wheels on, by all means. Just don't get discouraged or mad when it doesn't crawl better since the foam tuning hasn't been done.

Ah I see what you mean now. I agree 100%.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

Absolutely on all accounts. The big issue that I see is people spending money on upgrades that aren't actually addressing the root issue of bad tuning. That is what I'm wagging a finger about. Put those fancy wheels on, by all means. Just don't get discouraged or mad when it doesn't crawl better since the foam tuning hasn't been done.

Yup - human mentality these days. Youtube shows them what they want their machine (what ever it is) to do but after they sink a bunch of money they only get half the result.

[Ditchrat]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

A different hot end is useful if you are using PETG, nylon, or TPU and want to push it fast. If you are only printing PLA, or can deal with slow printing on hotter melt materials, the stock hot end is absolutely fine. The majority of upgrades that people do to these machines do nothing for print quality. It's more of a hobby of upgrading the machine, and then once it is all "upgraded" they lose interest and have nothing else to print. Quite a few of my friends have printers that do nothing after they printed all the "upgrades", because they bought it with no need for it.

Yeah I don't need to print fast, small batch production(at the very most)to have some odds and ends to give away to friends on the trail or making parts here and there for my projects.



I guess Ill be happy with just some tuning here and there. I had some idea about people upgrading to upgrade. I look at a lot of prints on the cr-10 using fancy looking machines and think my stuff is just as good.


I feel a little less like a slacker now. 3d printing has been more of a way to learn CAD for myself and try and give my son an interest in something that may be a career possibility.

[Rekreant]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

A different hot end is useful if you are using PETG, nylon, or TPU and want to push it fast. If you are only printing PLA, or can deal with slow printing on hotter melt materials, the stock hot end is absolutely fine. The majority of upgrades that people do to these machines do nothing for print quality. It's more of a hobby of upgrading the machine, and then once it is all "upgraded" they lose interest and have nothing else to print. Quite a few of my friends have printers that do nothing after they printed all the "upgrades", because they bought it with no need for it.

This. I prefer PETG for almost all my prints, and the V6 made it so much of a smoother process. I print at 35mm/sec.

[Rekreant]

Originally Posted by Ditchrat

Yeah I don't need to print fast, small batch production(at the very most)to have some odds and ends to give away to friends on the trail or making parts here and there for my projects.



I guess Ill be happy with just some tuning here and there. I had some idea about people upgrading to upgrade. I look at a lot of prints on the cr-10 using fancy looking machines and think my stuff is just as good.


I feel a little less like a slacker now. 3d printing has been more of a way to learn CAD for myself and try and give my son an interest in something that may be a career possibility.

Printing is easy, but CAD is definitely the challenge.

[Rekreant]

I also went to a better hotend cause I had a jam that basically covered my stock hotend in a brick of PETG. I upgraded my stock plastic feeder setup to a cheap metal one because after time I ended up wearing out springs, gears, and there was a lot of up and down slop in the lever part. 10$ aluminum part and I havent had an issue since. The only other upgrade I would say could be essential is auto bed leveling if your printer doesnt come with it. I got the TH3D auto leveling system and it took care of a bowed bed that I couldnt flatten out for the live of me.

[JSterrett]

I've only received one printed piece to date that could be considered a "production" part, and frankly the quality was awful.

I'm still trying to wrap my head around all the tuning variables, but it does feel good to be able to easily improve on a part if I need to.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

[JohnRobHolmes]

I would say a bowed bed needs to be replaced, and not masked by auto level trickery.

[Rekreant]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

I would say a bowed bed needs to be replaced, and not masked by auto level trickery.

Meh, in theory that sounds nice but in practice good luck finding one that doesnt get damaged in shipping. Having auto leveling accounts for so much more than just a bowed bed tho. I use solid steel risers now so no stupid adjustment of leveling springs that unscrew and loose tension over time. I NEVER have to adjust anything, and for 4 months now I have never had any bed adhesion or layer adhesion issues or adjustments.

[JohnRobHolmes]

I haven’t touched my production machines levelling since February. Just normal beds and switches. Set it and forget it, change first layer height in software for different filaments.

[JohnRobHolmes]

Blue locktite keeps bed screws from moving, fyi

[Ditchrat]

Originally Posted by JohnRobHolmes

I would say a bowed bed needs to be replaced, and not masked by auto level trickery.

I completely agree. I am no 3d wiz, but I replaced the cr10s glass with borosilicate. Nice and flat. Level the bed and go. My printer prints like you would expect a paper print. Start file, watch 2 lines or skirt. Level as needed then walk away.


That glass is so good that If I print on bare glass I have to wait for it to cool to take abs parts off. allot of time I use glue sticks just so I don't have to wait for bed to cool.